disarcina

more about gold glove awards over the year -- went back and checked. Jim Kaat may have more gold gloves than any one else in MLB history. He even won two more in the NL when he was traded to Philadelphia at the tail end of his career -- for at least one of those years, he probably wasn't even in the starting rotation but was more of a long relief guy/ spot starter -- remember -- this would have been 'back in the day' when the pen wasn't staffed the way it is today with designated closers, set up guys, pre- set up guys........you pretty much had starters and long relief. As Bob Gibson or one of the pitchers back in that era once said - if the manager was going to the pen, it meant you pitched a bad game........starters routinely had 25 plus complete game stats back then........now most TEAMS don't hit double digits for total CG for all starters in a season.

I think Nolasco will prove to be a serviceable number 4/5 starter. He is signed for $12 million for 2017 which is about 4th/5th starter money -- team option for 2018 and he gets a $1 million increase to $13 million if the Halos pick up the option. Expect more of the same (from the entire 2016 season stats not just his Halos starts) from 2016 he pitched 198 IP, 144 K's 44 BB 4.42 ERA with an 8-14 record. I think his 2017 numbers will be somewhat close to those -- Nolasco is a seasoned MLB starter. He can eat some innings and induce some groundball outs. The 2018 team option becomes also a player option if Nolasco pitches 400 IP for combined 2016-17 -- I interpret that to me if he pitches 203 IP in 2017, it gets converted into a player option. Some post here said they did not like the deadline deal for Nolasco -- I liked it. I thought we got as much out of Santiago as we could and traded him at his highest value. With Nolasco we have a seasoned MLB rotation guy at a reasonable price under club control for two years. In addition to all that -- after the trade, Nolasco -- as pointed out in this thread --- had some good starts and stats for us (and NO, we don't expect Nolasco to keep that level of performance for all of 2017) and after the trade, I don't think Santiago could buy a win for Minnesota -- his initial starts were pretty awful if I remember my review of the box scores right -- and I think he finally got a win but must have been something like 1-5 or worse with Minnesota. Not sure if Santiago is going to get any better for Minnesota for 2017 -- we got him as a pen depth guy, spot starter and possible 5th rotation guy and traded him as a 4/5 starter who, IMO, had his best years behind -- and got some value in return. Good deal for us, I think

I don't see us getting Chapman -- that would be quite a splash and a lot of money spent for 2017/18 seasons which probably doesn't fit into the Angels time-table.

how dumb do the Dodgers look now for passing on that Chapman deal they had completed? I thought they reacted too soon when they did that and thought -- at that time -- they made a mistake. The Yankees signed him and he performed well for them and then, at deadline time, the Yankees get FOUR quality prospects for a Chapman lease to the Cubs - that's a trade that's going to turn out pretty well for both clubs -- perhaps -- because Chapman has clearly led the Cubs into and in the post-season -- but taking the long view -- those players the Cubs gave up are going to be quality players under Yankee club control for some time. Meanwhile Chapman walks as a F/A. I would think the Dodgers re-sign Jensen.

of that bunch -- Nolasco likely to be in our rotation next year -- I think he's under contract for at least two more season. not sure about Chacin.......if he's not signed beyond this season -- he could get an ST invite but that's about it, I would think. meanwhile Jered Weaver's agent is probably out letting GM's know he'll be available -- I don't see the Angels making much of an effort to keep him and may NON-tender him because he could accept a Halos offer.......not sure if the MLBPA contract terms have changed in this regard -- I know during the last two off-seasons there was some angst about the rule where the Clubs lost a draft pick if a team signed a F/A who was tendered an offer and rejected it..........the feeling was this caused teams to shy away from signing players who would cost them a draft pick and many MLB 'seasoned' players found themselves unsigned or having to wait until May 1 or whenever the date is that teams could sign these tendered players without losing a draft pick to the player's prior team. there was talk about changing that rule -- not sure if it's been changed. The whole discussion about this and experience with the rule shows how the value of top draft picks have increased in value and in importance to teams in today's MLB.........much of this has come at the expense of the veteran player who was either not a starter or fairly marginal -- these guys with 4 years or so of MLB experience are seeing their careers being of shorter duration than in the past as they lose their jobs to young (lesser expensive) prospect who can fill the depth roles.

little late to the party here -- but thanks to Dave Saltzer for posting that very informative post about his impressions from the Eppler talk. sounds like we're going to spend most of the discretionary dollars we have available this off-season on a quality starting pitcher (Hellickson?) and perhaps a 2B. Sounds like we might be going in-house for a LF'er again -- who is this Jam Jones guy? Not familiar with him but for 2017 he sounds like the guy we see in every ST camp who burns up the early ST game pitching, posts some great power numbers and then winds up at AAA or more likely AA. (AA is actually better for developing players -- AAA is a bunch of bitter guys who've come down from the bigs and are no longer 'prospects' ; 4-A guys the organizations want to keep around in case of injuries, other depth guys --particularly pen arms -- and perhaps a young prospect pitcher a step away from making it --- the better training and tutelage for young players is at the AA level). I see Cron as trade bait -- Pujols will play half his games or more at DH next year....... there's a guy out there who could play some 2B, 1B, LF and even DH and do fairly well -- he's been in Dodger Blue the past two seasons -- his name is Kendrick. Not bad for a one plus one contract during two years when we're probably not going to be in contention. Dodgers seem to have a log jam at 2B and LF and probably won't sign HK again. Calhoun is great trade bait for the Angels if they want to trade for that quality starter -- but we've got him under contract through 2018 so it probably makes more sense to deal him at deadline time in 2018..........I don't think we're going to get anyone better than Calhoun for RF. Again, Dave Saltzer -- thanks for the report. Well done -- as always.

yep -- we have a long way to go to improve to be competitive. I do not see us being competitive in 2017 and perhaps not in 2018. I only hope we can keep the best player in MLB on our team during two more 'lost' seasons of no playoffs and not really contending to the point games in August and September are meaningless.

Oberholtzer's ERA was about 7.00 the past year. he was never that great but was, at one time, a serviceable MLB starter, 4 or 5th rotation spot guy for a mid market non-contender (is that us these days?) oh well.

I remember Orlando Cabrera getting robbed of the award by a well past his prime Jeter who, that year, DH'd quite a bit and took a few days off as well. Orlando Cabrera - a player who I really liked even back in his Montreal days (and that's a ways back) might have played in all 162 games or very close to it, anyway, that year for the Halos, was absolutely stellar for us a-field and had a good year at the plate as well -- and didn't win the Gold Glove award. I will have to look it up -- but Orlando Cabrera -- he played for us about what ? two/ three seasons only ? I thought he played very well for the Halos and was sort of sad that we didn't sign him to a new contract back then - I think he wound up with Minnesota and perhaps another team before his playing days were over-- but the guy had a pretty good MLB career which wasn't noticed much because he spent his best years playing in Montreal getting no media coverage and what little coverage there was went to Vlad. The real rotten thing about O-Cab getting robbed that year was that for Jeetz it was just another Gold Glove (he had several -- how he would ever beat out Omar Vizquel when both were starting SS in the AL is beyond me -- don't think there are many SS in MLB history - other than Ozzie Smith - that rank up there defensively with Vizquel) is that a Gold Glove for the relatively unheralded and unrewarded O-Cab would have meant a lot more to him than just another automatic award for Jeetz -- aside from the fact that O-Cab was clearly more deserving that year.

Is Jim Kaat still winning the award at the AL Pitchers' spot. lot of the comments on this thread ring so true -- at certain positions (like pitcher) a certain guy wins one year and then that same player tends to become a lock up until the time he retires and if some of the folks aren't paying a lot of attention......may even win the award post-retirement !! The Palmiero at 1B story is amazing -- I was probably outraged at the time but can't remember. I guess my first question would have been : You mean Palimeiro actually owns a glove? check the pitcher's winning this thing over the years -- you'll see the same name over and over again. Grienke changes teams and still is on the list.......may not have a great year on the Hill but man can he field his position !!! LOL !!!! Let's see if Yadier can hold off Buster this year -- I still think Yadier is the best in the NL but have to give the MLB nod to Salvator Perez these days and the Cleveland catcher is turning heads in this World Series -- fielding and offense.

well, Correa isn't even a finalist......but Francisco Lindor is -- so he probably wins at SS. Both of our Gold Glove finalists -- Simmons (124 games) and Carlos Perez (spent some time at AAA) played in fewer games than the folks they are competing against for the award. As for Carlos Perez -- no wonder he's one of three finalists -- the league had to pick two other guys some how - I think Salvadore Perez of the KC Royals may have the Gold Glove award wrapped up for the next ten years. As for the Angels -- how is Mike Trout NOT a finalist in CF ???

Simmons was stellar at short but may have spent too much time on the DL to win the award. Some how I think the Houston SS wins it.

Didn't Carlos Perez spend part of the season at SLC?

The COA has been trying to develop the Golden Triangle area for years with limited to no success - there are some 'newer' projects there -- the 'new' Catch Restaurant (which IMO pales in comparison to the old classic Catch but times move on) and the condo projects right there next to the Catch and the other ones at the NE corner of State College Blvd and Katella but the parking lot area and that area across Gene Autry Way (which for years had streets and a parking area stubbed out but little else) remain undeveloped. Although there's that other high end looking condo projects on State College near Orangewood -- the one closer to Gene Autry Way and the other one that stands on the site where the swap meet was held on weekends........not sure what the vacancy / rental vs. ownership rate is on these places. In time it will happen -- the entire area will be developed and there might even be enough folks living near there to support dining places more than what's the limited offerings available there now -- essentially The Catch, Denny's and fast food places. Oh yeah - and the dirty McDonald's on the corner..... not been there much, few times I have been over the year, the place looks like it needs a daily health inspection. The problem is numerous investor types have gone broke waiting to develop the Golden Triangle area all these years. Let's see if this newest iteration of a proposal works

well, he'll need some good reading material while covering the Angels 'winter meetings' it'll be like waiting at the airport -- I don't see much happening with the Halos. does anyone see any blockbuster deals or big signings? I don't. Some tinkering around the edges of the roster. One thing I ask of the Halos front office -- don't do what the Dodgers used to do and I think the Halos have been guilty of on occasion -- don't have a real 'do nothing' off-season and then have the GM and front office narrative be that the one or two second tier deals/ signings made are a BIG DEAL and going to transform the club........please not that. Stick with --" we didn't do much" (which, from some of the past Halos' off-season moves, may be BETTER than doing SOMETHING) "and we're going with what we got hoping to compete.........if everything goes right and we don't suffer a batch of injuries we might be in position to make a deadline deal for the stretch run that could make a difference." that's a lot better than "hey, this lower level prospect we got for Catcher Carlos Perez is going to break out big" (Have we already traded Perez away? Can't remember).

have not been to the Anaheim yard in two years now. we'll see about next year. I did make it to Tempe Diablo the past two seasons - and I made several games at AT&T Park in SF. I think I am going to attend a Kings game or two this year instead.........although with Jonathan Quick out for three months - things don't look great there either.

If MLB keeps messing with the game to make it something other than the traditional baseball that we all grew up with, the no blocking the plate stuff (The Buster ****** Rule), the new Chase Utley Rule re sliding hard at 2B to break up a double play,etc. One other thing drives me nuts -- ballpark used to be a fairly relaxing peaceful place to be between innings -- now we have seemingly non-stop blasting music as if it's some sort of rave or something.........bring back the simple organ music........

I'm for whatever works best financially for all the good folks running the site here and makes their life easier. if it means NESN - a BoSox Nation type affiliation -- so be it. just don't me root for the Red Sox -- I still contend that Boston has the most obnoxious fans in all MLB........ of course, some folks think Angels fans are comatose most of the time........recently we haven't had much reason to anything but that.

for us tech challenged folks -- does this mean we have to do something or will Angelswin.com still be there when I click on my favorites link for Angelswin.com? NESN ? Why do I relate that with the Boston Red Sox??

Angels have a very limited time table to do anything -- I think they need to re-up next year and then vacate by 2019. no way a new Stadium gets built anywhere in California within two years. as for the Halos just up and leaving (and I really don't see any scenario where that happens -- look at the Oakland A's with what is probably the worst stadium situation in MLB, with a City that won't work with them and is actually hostile towards them and with some of the worst attendance numbers in MLB -- they've been trying to move for years and the obstacles are too great........Bud Selig never acted to help them and denied them the ability to move several times, his successor has done little as the seemingly bad situation in Oakland some how gets even worse...........) A's should be allowed to move to San Jose -- MLB won't let them -- OK -- Sacramento -- but the SF Giants moved their PCL team there (just to block an A's move, IMO) and how about Las Vegas?? MLB won't let them (let's see if the NFL green lights to Raiders to Vegas -- I think they will). so the A's in that situation are stuck for years -- and the Angels -- really no where to go -- no one is building a stadium and truth be known, if they did try to bluff a move to stall/ impact the surrounding development -- the Chinese investors would pivot and the City would rather have a Disneyland related function at the site -- perhaps an additional Disney themed hotel with extra Disney parking surrounding it and a ground transportation hub for shuttles to Disneyland --- Chinese investors would adjust and Trout Farm would become some sort of Disney kids fishing attraction........yeah, they'll take a Dean Chance on all that..........

reading the posts on this thread is interesting. the Halos withdrawing their opposition to a project adjacent to and near the Stadium property is not the same thing as the Halos and the City coming to an agreement on a long term Stadium lease. what happened here is the Halos created some waves by objecting to a project proposal on property that would have impacted the city's offer (withdrawn some time ago) to Arte for a $1 a year lease in exchange for developing the stadium area property and agreeing to make certain stadium and area improvements. That offer voted upon (and passed) the City Council but the Mayor objected and the offer was withdrawn. This development proposal makes the witndrawn offer less attractive because it potentially decreases the value of the proposed Arte controlled development next to the Park with a competing like-kind project. The Halos withdrew their appeal because the development consultants/legal team advising Arte no doubt let him know -- this appeal is a loser. Rather than appeal a losing effort appeal, the Halos talked the developer on the adjacent site who's reps probably told the Halos 'pound sand' we're moving forward. So the two sides talk, some very cosmetic like concessions are made and 'an agreement' reached. This really does little in terms of the Halos/ City talks but may spell the final death knell for the prior city offer which was in rigor mortis status anyway.

Naps homers and now steals a base leading to another Tribe run........... he must know that Scioscia's watching......... how many playoff teams has Naps been on since leaving the Halos in that trade to Toronto???? (How long was he a member of the Blue Jays? 15 minutes?).

Reddick -- that's what the Angels need - a guy rejected by the A's and then the Dodgers. great way to build for the future....... Look, Reddick is OK - had some good years with Oakland -- I just think if we sign him we're looking at a two year stop gap plan for the Halos -- which, realistically, may be where the Halos are right now. If we get Reddick during the off-season, it sort of confirms that's where the Halos are.......oh well. perhaps you can chalk this post up to yours truly not really wanting to acknowledge reality -- that is - -the 2017 and perhaps '18 season(s) may be already over for us.

I'd welcome Howie back --- not sure that's in the Angels plans though and Howie probably wants to go somewhere where he starts -- either at 2B or in LF.

if we are talking about Sogard, it portends a 2017 season where the games start getting meaningless in July...........