OC Register: Ron Washington doesn’t think Angels need star additions to contend

[Inside Pitch]

14 minutes ago, BTH said:

I worry they won’t. The way Wash has spoke glowingly about him all year, despite the issues.

Move him to the pen -- have him be the long guy.  The key to being able to do that is the other asshat taking HIS offseason seriously.  Suarez is ahead of Canning IMO, but he too has a history of not putting in the work in the off-season.

[BTH]

29 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Move him to the pen -- have him be the long guy.  The key to being able to do that is the other asshat taking HIS offseason seriously.  Suarez is ahead of Canning IMO, but he too has a history of not putting in the work in the off-season.

I’m just not sure they’re gonna all of a sudden change from the way they’ve gone about things.

[Dgar24]

30 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Move him to the pen -- have him be the long guy.  The key to being able to do that is the other asshat taking HIS offseason seriously.  Suarez is ahead of Canning IMO, but he too has a history of not putting in the work in the off-season.

I’m good with Canning traded, starting mlb pitcher  should fetch a little something. Sandy non tendered and Detmers traded. None of them ever developed that  is on them. Blame coaches, ownership or Gm whatever if you must, but let’s start fresh. Soriano, Koch ext. sign a few pitchers 

Out with the old.

 

[Hubs]

My offseason would look like this.

Arbitration Non-tender: Suarez, Maybe Fullmer.

Arbitration Tender:  Burke, Quijada, Canning, Moniak, Adell, Ward, Rengifo, Thaiss, Detmers

Free Agents returning: None. No Qualifying Offers

Under Contract: Rendon, Trout, Stephenson, Anderson

Club Control: Neto, O'Hoppe, Schanuel, Soriano, Kochanawicz, Etc.

Free Agents: Sasaki if he's posted. Flaherty. OF Santander. DH Pederson. SS/2B Farmer.

Trade: Acquire Christian Encarnacion-Strand & Jonathan India from Reds for Moniak, Klassen or Silseth , Sandoval, & Adams (Or something like this).

Strand to AAA, India as 2B/3B (he played 3B in minors). Moore starts in AAA.

 

[Angel Oracle]

The one bright side is now having a lineup in 2025 that has seen each player having played a full MLB season.

No more burning out by Augudt

Injuries have to decrease though.

That lineup though does need a RHH OF who can share CF with Moniak, and a 3B.   

Edited 17 hours ago by Angel Oracle

[Angel Oracle]

Also see if the Nats will take back Rendon, with the Halos paying 80-90% of his remaining salary.

[totdprods]

They’re in kind of a tough spot with the lineup. On paper, every spot can be filled right now with someone at least somewhat deserving/expected. 

• C- O’Hoppe 
• 1B- Schanuel 
• 2B- Rengifo
• SS- Neto
• 3B- Rendon
• LF- Ward
• CF- Moniak
• RF- Adell
• DH - Trout

I know it could be said neither Adell nor Moniak are due everyday play, but they showed enough in ‘24 to realistically be slotted in for a rebuilding club. Moniak’s our best defensive CF, and Trout in all honesty should DH as often as possible. And I think it behooves the Angels to try and give them everyday opportunity in 2025. Either they step up and become big pieces going forward - trade bait or kept - or if they falter, will have certainly had enough leash by then where it’s easy to cut bait. 

I know Rendon will get hurt, but when that happens Rengifo moves over, Moore comes up. 

On the offensive side, the emphasis will be needing to add some bench/insurance that can capably play everyday, and I think that’s probably difficult for the Angels to sign on the free agent market. Hard to get decent players sign up to be utility players on a last-place team. 

Looking at what they have, they need…

• A capable UT IF who can spot different positions once Rendon gets hurt and Rengifo/Moore are pressed into play…probably, unfortunately, guys like DeJong, IKF, Rosario best fits. Profar perhaps, but he doesn’t see much IF play these days. This also gives them someone to sort of bridge Rengifo’s role if he’s traded at deadline ‘25
• Another outfielder who can hit LHP when Moniak sits, or a 1B/DH/OF type who hits lefties well, so mix in with the OFs, DH, and occasionally Schanuel. Someone like a Refsnyder, Canha, Cooper.

It’s tough because if there was one OF who shouldn’t play everyday…it’s Moniak, who would be a pretty great 4th OF. But he’s also our best guy to boot Trout to a corner or DH, and the FA OF options all also profile better in the corners, so it’s not as easy as just saying dump/bench Moniak and sign an OF improvement. Only other configuration that would make sense is slotting Adell into CF, using Moniak as our 4th OF, and then having Trout take over RF, with DH now opened up - and that’s when someone like a Teoscar or Santander could become much more realistic. But I’m not so sure about Adell in CF.

I think the biggest work should be done in the rotation, bench and the bullpen. They can make an effort there without breaking the bank and it would shore up the team nicely, without putting too much pressure to compete.

• Sign Manaea, Kikuchi, Pivetta, or Boyd
• Attempt Flaherty or Burnes, but even a 1-yr RHP vet would be useful, just to eat innings, DeSclafani, Williams, Turnbull, maybe even Buehler
• Trade Detmers to STL for Nolan Gorman to help back-up 2B/3B and bring another young bat to the mix 
• Bring Estevez back to co-close/set-up
• Sign 2-3 cheap 1-yr vet RPs, stash the optionable RPs in AA/AAA until needed
• One more bat…anywhere from a Kiner-Falefa to a Canha/Refsnyder or the Teoscar/Santander OF/DH above, with Adell moving to CF, Trout to RF, and Moniak to 4th OF

 

Edited 17 hours ago by totdprods

[BTH]

1 minute ago, totdprods said:

know Rendon will get hurt, but when that happens Rengifo moves over, Moore comes up. 

And then what happens when Rengifo gets hurt? (Which has happened the previous three seasons)

3 minutes ago, totdprods said:

On the offensive side, the emphasis will be needing to add some bench/insurance that can capably play everyday, and I think that’s probably difficult for the Angels to sign on the free agent market. Hard to get decent players sign up to be utility players on a last-place team. 

That’s why you release Rendon, don’t count on Rengifo to be a starter, and get a starter at 2B and 3B. Then Rengifo is MLB depth and Moore is MILB depth to start the season.

[totdprods]

7 minutes ago, BTH said:

And then what happens when Rengifo gets hurt? (Which has happened the previous three seasons)

That’s why you release Rendon, don’t count on Rengifo to be a starter, and get a starter at 2B and 3B. Then Rengifo is MLB depth and Moore is MILB depth to start the season.

I think we’re nearing the point where Rendon gets released, but I don’t think it happens this offseason. We’ve cut bait with big money guys before, but not two full seasons before their contracts were up. I could see May ‘25 being the earliest. As bad as Rendon has been, I don’t think there’s enough org depth or FA 3B availability on the market to make the Angels cut bait with him this winter. 

As to what happens when Rengifo gets hurt? That’s why I said they need to probably pursue a Kiner-Falefa, DeJong or Rosario. 

The 2B/3B market this winter is beyond thin, especially after Gleyber and Bregman. I don’t think they’ll sign a 2B with Moore as “close” to ready as he is, and I don’t think they’ll plunk down big money on a 3B with Rendon still owed two seasons.

Edited 17 hours ago by totdprods

[totdprods]

And then hope deadline ‘25 you can move Anderson, Canning if he’s here still somehow, Rengifo unless extended, and maybe one of Ward, Adell or Moniak. Should be able to really stock up the farm.

At that point you should be able to replace Anderson and Canning from within by way of Dana, Aldegheri, Kochanowicz, Silseth, Daniel, Bachman, or Klassen.

Moore comes up to replace Rengifo. Won’t be an OF replacement, but ideally, if you move one, it’s because the other three (Ward, Adell/Moniak, Trout) have stayed healthy and productive. Rada isn’t there yet, but maybe 2026. Maybe Flint able to move up the depth chart.

Edited 16 hours ago by totdprods

[Dgar24]

13 minutes ago, totdprods said:

I think we’re nearing the point where Rendon gets released, but I don’t think it happens this offseason. We’ve cut bait with big money guys before, but not two full seasons before their contracts were up. I could see May ‘25 being the earliest. As bad as Rendon has been, I don’t think there’s enough org depth or FA 3B availability on the market to make the Angels cut bait with him this winter. 

As to what happens when Rengifo gets hurt? That’s why I said they need to probably pursue a Kiner-Falefa, DeJong or Rosario. 

The 2B/3B market this winter is beyond thin, especially after Gleyber and Bregman. I don’t think they’ll sign a 2B with Moore as “close” to ready as he is, and I don’t think they’ll plunk down big money on a 3B with Rendon still owed two seasons.

No interest in Kim from SanDiego he can opt out. Thoughts?

[BTH]

14 minutes ago, totdprods said:

I think we’re nearing the point where Rendon gets released, but I don’t think it happens this offseason. We’ve cut bait with big money guys before, but not two full seasons before their contracts were up. I could see May ‘25 being the earliest. As bad as Rendon has been, I don’t think there’s enough org depth or FA 3B availability on the market to make the Angels cut bait with him this winter. 

As to what happens when Rengifo gets hurt? That’s why I said they need to probably pursue a Kiner-Falefa, DeJong or Rosario. 

The 2B/3B market this winter is beyond thin, especially after Gleyber and Bregman. I don’t think they’ll sign a 2B with Moore as “close” to ready as he is, and I don’t think they’ll plunk down big money on a 3B with Rendon still owed two seasons.

Yeah, Spring of 2026 seems like the likely time when Rendon gets released.

Falefa isn’t a FA till 2026. I like Gleyber as an option. DeJong and Rosario are unexciting, but acceptable bench options.

[totdprods]

3 minutes ago, Dgar24 said:

No interest in Kim from SanDiego he can opt out. Thoughts?

If he indeed hits the market, yeah I’d be interested, but it’s a mutual option and I’m not sure he leaves SD.

[Dgar24]

I hope so right type of player to spend on. 

[totdprods]

1 minute ago, BTH said:

Yeah, Spring of 2026 seems like the likely time when Rendon gets released.

Falefa isn’t a FA till 2026. I like Gleyber as an option. DeJong and Rosario are unexciting, but acceptable bench options.

The problem with Gleyber is he has been intent on staying at 2B. When the Yankees brought in Chisholm, Gleyber flatly said he’s a second baseman. If he was willing to move, I doubt it’d be for the last-place Angels. And we still have Rendon. And it doesn’t seem the Angels don’t think Moore will move off 2B yet. It sounded like Wash even said Moore would’ve been up had he not been hurt, so that tells me he’ll be at 2B for the Angels reallllly soon, if not Opening Day.

[BTH]

Just now, totdprods said:

The problem with Gleyber is he has been intent on staying at 2B. When the Yankees brought in Chisholm, Gleyber flatly said he’s a second baseman. If he was willing to move, I doubt it’d be for the last-place Angels. And we still have Rendon. And it doesn’t seem the Angels don’t think Moore will move off 2B yet. It sounded like Wash even said Moore would’ve been up had he not been hurt, so that tells me he’ll be at 2B for the Angels reallllly soon, if not Opening Day.

Let Moore develop in the minors till the deadline, then trade Gleyber at the deadline? Could also maybe DH one of them.

[totdprods]

7 minutes ago, BTH said:

Yeah, Spring of 2026 seems like the likely time when Rendon gets released.

Falefa isn’t a FA till 2026. I like Gleyber as an option. DeJong and Rosario are unexciting, but acceptable bench options.

Ah didn’t catch that about IKF. Bummer cause he’s a good fit, IMO. Rosario is Rengifo-lite on a good day…but that’s not saying much. DeJong unfortunately makes a lot of sense, as he’s still solid defensively and has some pop, but more importantly could actually back-up SS, which would be nice. Rengifo shouldn’t be there, and rostering someone like Jack Lopez, Andrew Velazquez or a 4A true SS isn’t worth it. 

1 minute ago, BTH said:

Let Moore develop in the minors till the deadline, then trade Gleyber at the deadline? Could also maybe DH one of them.

No chwnce Gleyber signs a one-year deal, and guys on multi-year deals rarely get dealt their first deadline. He’s the best 2B on the FA market by a mile. He’ll get 3-4 years pretty easily, I think. And like I said, I don’t think the Angels are going to develop Moore in the minors. Wash hinted that he would’ve been here already if he hadn’t gotten hurt, and his performance at AA was no worse than Schanuel or Neto before they came up. Fully expect Moore to be on the big league club sooner rather than later in 2025, unless he’s hurt or really craters in Spring/minors.

[BTH]

6 minutes ago, totdprods said:

Ah didn’t catch that about IKF. Bummer cause he’s a good fit, IMO.

Could probably trade for him. I doubt Pittsburgh wants to pay a utility guy $6.5M

[totdprods]

If I could draw it up, in a way I felt was realistic, would not break the bank, would not push expectations too far but also make the team competitive not just in 2025 but beyond, this is what I’d shoot for…

Rotation:

• Flaherty (no more than 5/$85M, otherwise go for a 1-yr flier on someone else)
• Manaea/Kikuchi/Boyd/Pivetta (2-3/$32-45M, basically the new Anderson)
• Anderson (dealt in July, replaced within)
• Canning (dealt in July, replaced within)
• Soriano

Bullpen:

• Joyce
• Estevez (2/$20M)
• Two or three 1-yr vets (Farmer, Martin, Floro, Sewald, Strickland), all dealt in July and replaced from within
• Fulmer
• Quijada
• rotating the last spots for the optionable arms (Crouse, Zeferjahn, etc.)

Lineup:

• Catcher: O’Hoppe
• 1B: Schanuel
• 2B: Rengifo (dealt in July, replaced within)
• SS: Neto
• 3B: Rendon
• LF: Ward*
• CF: Adell*
• RF: Trout
• DH: Santander or Teoscar

Bench:

• Catcher: Thaiss
• 1B/3B: Detmers trade return (Gorman? CIN? CLE?)
• UT IF: DeJong/Kyle Farmer (maybe dealt in July, replaced within) 
• OF: Moniak*

*If Ward, Adell and Moniak are all hitting well and Trout is healthy, you could move one, or keep them all. With Teoscar/Santander, we should be set.

Almost all the new FA guys aren’t blocking anyone, just effectively bridging/replacing/extending guys like Anderson, Rengifo and Ward once they get moved.

No prospects spent either. A lot to be gained in July. That team is set up to be a .500 team/WC contender if everyone is healthy in 2025. Payroll isn’t so clogged up that it keeps them from locking in the young core 2025 and beyond, or adding again via FA in next winter or two following. 

Edited 16 hours ago by totdprods

[Tank]

1 hour ago, totdprods said:

• C- O’Hoppe 
• 1B- Schanuel 
• 2B- Rengifo
• SS- Neto
• 3B- Rendon
• LF- Ward
• CF- Moniak
• RF- Adell
• DH - Trout

that would be a decent lineup.

i'll bet they don't play more than 30 games together (unfortunately). 

[Rollinghard]

14 hours ago, totdprods said:

If I could draw it up, in a way I felt was realistic, would not break the bank, would not push expectations too far but also make the team competitive not just in 2025 but beyond, this is what I’d shoot for…

Rotation:

• Flaherty (no more than 5/$85M, otherwise go for a 1-yr flier on someone else)
• Manaea/Kikuchi/Boyd/Pivetta (2-3/$32-45M, basically the new Anderson)
• Anderson (dealt in July, replaced within)
• Canning (dealt in July, replaced within)
• Soriano

Bullpen:

• Joyce
• Estevez (2/$20M)
• Two or three 1-yr vets (Farmer, Martin, Floro, Sewald, Strickland), all dealt in July and replaced from within
• Fulmer
• Quijada
• rotating the last spots for the optionable arms (Crouse, Zeferjahn, etc.)

Lineup:

• Catcher: O’Hoppe
• 1B: Schanuel
• 2B: Rengifo (dealt in July, replaced within)
• SS: Neto
• 3B: Rendon
• LF: Ward*
• CF: Adell*
• RF: Trout
• DH: Santander or Teoscar

Bench:

• Catcher: Thaiss
• 1B/3B: Detmers trade return (Gorman? CIN? CLE?)
• UT IF: DeJong/Kyle Farmer (maybe dealt in July, replaced within) 
• OF: Moniak*

*If Ward, Adell and Moniak are all hitting well and Trout is healthy, you could move one, or keep them all. With Teoscar/Santander, we should be set.

Almost all the new FA guys aren’t blocking anyone, just effectively bridging/replacing/extending guys like Anderson, Rengifo and Ward once they get moved.

No prospects spent either. A lot to be gained in July. That team is set up to be a .500 team/WC contender if everyone is healthy in 2025. Payroll isn’t so clogged up that it keeps them from locking in the young core 2025 and beyond, or adding again via FA in next winter or two following. 

So you are basically saying, we are going to suck again. 

[totdprods]

59 minutes ago, Rollinghard said:

So you are basically saying, we are going to suck again. 

No, I said they’d be in good place to meet .500 and potentially be a WC contender.

There’s no realistic path the Angels could take this winter that would guarantee they’d go from a 97+ loss team to a 85+ winner. They could sign Burnes and Soto and I still don’t think it would guarantee that. It’ll just result in another top-heavy team contingent on expensive, aging talent to stay healthy and productive not just to their talents, but also to make up for the other talents the team wouldn’t be able to afford that they would still need.

The goal for 2025 should be getting back to a .500 team. Get 80 wins. If they do that, it’ll be because the young core stayed healthy and took a step forward, complimented by a couple decent moves to bring in vets to patch the holes in the rotation, bench and bullpen. The guys we bring in aren’t here to make a difference, they’re to shore up and support the next generation of young players. And if they do that, I think they’ll be in prime shape to get back to 90+ wins by 2026.

[Ron Mexico]

Fuck Arte the Angels will never be shit as long as he is the owner.  We need to boycott the games . I will never buy a ticket nor buy merchandise as long as he is the owner