Logan O'Hoppe is a stud

[Angelsjunky]

His 2.6 WAR is 20th best all-time among Angels catchers with 300+ PA. Think about that for a moment. Sure, the Angels org hasn't exactly been deep at catcher, but that is still impressive for the 24-year old in his first full season. If he gets to 3 WAR, he'll join only five other Angels catchers in that club: Brian Downing (twice), Ellie Rodriguez, Lance Parrish, Martin Maldonado, and Bob Boone (twice). 4 WAR is only Downing, Parrish, and Rodriguez; 5 WAR only Downing.

If he gets to 3.3 WAR this year, it will be the 4th best catching season by an Angel.

[CaliAngel]

Some say he has a better butt than Trout, but I'm not sure I agree with that.

[katie]

34 minutes ago, CaliAngel said:

Some say he has a better butt than Trout, but I'm not sure I agree with that.

[tdawg87]

I do.

[T.G.]

1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

If he gets to 3.3 WAR this year, it will be the 4th best catching season by an Angel.

RIP Logan.

[itsKnoppUitsme]

3 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

His 1.9 WAR is 20th best all-time among Angels catchers with 300+ PA. Think about that for a moment. Sure, the Angels org hasn't exactly been deep at catcher, but that is still impressive for the 24-year old in his first full season. If he gets to 3 WAR, he'll join only five other Angels catchers in that club: Brian Downing (twice), Ellie Rodriguez, Lance Parrish, Martin Maldonado, and Bob Boone (twice). 4 WAR is only Downing, Parrish, and Rodriguez; 5 WAR only Downing.

If he gets to 3.3 WAR this year, it will be the 4th best catching season by an Angel.

I’m surprised that Benji Molina is not on that list.

[Blarg]

3 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

His 1.9 WAR is 20th best all-time among Angels catchers with 300+ PA. Think about that for a moment. Sure, the Angels org hasn't exactly been deep at catcher, but that is still impressive for the 24-year old in his first full season. If he gets to 3 WAR, he'll join only five other Angels catchers in that club: Brian Downing (twice), Ellie Rodriguez, Lance Parrish, Martin Maldonado, and Bob Boone (twice). 4 WAR is only Downing, Parrish, and Rodriguez; 5 WAR only Downing.

If he gets to 3.3 WAR this year, it will be the 4th best catching season by an Angel.

Downing was only a full time catcher with the Angels for two seasons, 1978 and 1979 and was 28 and 29 at the time when he hit 3 and 5 WAR. I'm pretty sure O'Hoppe is going to surpass his 3 war seasons but not sure if he can get to 5 war, that is a pretty high bar for a catcher these days since WAR is a counting stat and catchers split duties more now then back then. 

[Taylor]

37 minutes ago, itsKnoppUitsme said:

I’m surprised that Benji Molina is not on that list.

Best ass or top catcher?

[tdawg87]

Just now, Taylor said:

Best ass or top catcher?

Yes etc

[katie]

4 minutes ago, Taylor said:

Best ass or top catcher?

How can you be a top and a catcher?

[Taylor]

6 minutes ago, katie said:

How can you be a top and a catcher?

Top ass or best catcher? 

[Blarg]

My wife wanted to sit in left field all of the time because Downing played with his backside to her. That was before the stadium remodel so she got a good view. 

[T.G.]

1 hour ago, itsKnoppUitsme said:

I’m surprised that Benji Molina is not on that list.

Or Bengie Molina

[Chuck]

1 hour ago, katie said:

How can you be a top and a catcher?

[CaliAngel]

Make ONE comment about man butt and now these are littered on my Angelswin feed.

Thanks Chuck!

 

[itsKnoppUitsme]

3 hours ago, T.G. said:

Or Bengie Molina

Yeah, him too!

[Angelsjunky]

15 hours ago, itsKnoppUitsme said:

I’m surprised that Benji Molina is not on that list.

fWAR doesn't love Bengie - his best season is 2.2, then 2.1 (twice, once with SF). I think he is memorable to Angels fans because he was pretty consistent and around for awhile, and he was on the 2002 team.

Of course fWAR's Def for catchers is kind of weird in that it includes pitch-framing, so you have guys like Jonathan Lucroy, Russell Martin, and Brian McCann with multiple 6+ WAR seasons. Seems kind of iffy to me, but who knows. @Inside Pitch?

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

fWAR doesn't love Bengie - his best season is 2.2, then 2.1 (twice, once with SF). I think he is memorable to Angels fans because he was pretty consistent and around for awhile, and he was on the 2002 team.

Of course fWAR's Def for catchers is kind of weird in that it includes pitch-framing, so you have guys like Jonathan Lucroy, Russell Martin, and Brian McCann with multiple 6+ WAR seasons. Seems kind of iffy to me, but who knows. @Inside Pitch?

Framing wasn't a part of WAR until  2008, so that dings him since offensively he was pretty limited.  They also reworked it a few years back where it framing became significantly more important part of the catcher war formulas..  

Ultimately I think his greatest attribute as a catcher was his pitch calling and that simply doesn't show up in the data.

[happybat4]

There was some good hitting catchers back when Molina played. Molina wasn't a great hitter, almost never walked, he was also one of the slowest runners in all of baseball.

[Hubs]

1979 Downing was 5.6 on bWAR. 5.0 on fWAR.

1982 and 1988 Boone was at 3.5 and 3.1 bWAR and 3.2 both years on fWAR.

Maldonado's 2017 is valued at 1.7 bWAR but 3.2 fWAR.

Parrish's 1990 was at 4.5 bWAR and 4.6 fWAR.

Molina's 2005 was 2.4 on bWAR but 1.7 on fWAR.

O'Hoppe's 2024 is currently 2.6 bWAR and 2.0 on fWAR.

 

It's clear that the best overall seasons between the two metrics are Downing in 1979 and Parrish's 1990. Bob Boone's 1982 and 1988 would be next. Offensively, an .800 OPS with 14 HR is pretty darn good. If he finished with 20-25 HR and that .800 OPS I'd be pretty excited.

O'Hoppe will benefit from a better lineup in future years, though Parrish's lineup in his Angels career wasn't that good either.

Downing's 1979 season featured an .880 OPS with only 12 HR but it was a different era. Downing hit .326 though with a .418 OPS. 

 

 

[Angelsjunky]

^Yup. I think there's good reason to be excited about O'Hoppe - we really haven't ever had a young catcher his talent. I think he's got room to improve on both sides of the plate, also, and has a chance to put together a season or two challenging Downing's 1979 - and maybe more well-rounded.

I only remember Downing as a DH/OF, but from what I gather he wasn't very good behind the plate.

[Inside Pitch]

27 minutes ago, happybat4 said:

There was some good hitting catchers back when Molina played. Molina wasn't a great hitter, almost never walked, he was also one of the slowest runners in all of baseball.

His offensive profile doesn't register with war.  His biggest attribute as a hitter was that he didn't K, its what made his not walking less painful.  As you pointed out, his career took place at a time when baseball was very offensively driven.  He was one of those guys that you looked at and thought, well he's not hurting you so he's fine because his defense is what it is.

Dude was undervalued by WAR.

[Angelsjunky]

Yeah, I agree IP - with the caveat that even in hindsight, I see his value as that of being a consistent solid regular who was pretty good defensively and not a total loss offensively. But the point being, his main point of value was that he was consistently there. He didn't wow you, but at least you could rely on solid performance. Sort of like the Disarcina of catchers.

[Blarg]

39 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Framing wasn't a part of WAR until  2008, so that dings him since offensively he was pretty limited.  They also reworked it a few years back where it framing became significantly more important part of the catcher war formulas..  

Ultimately I think his greatest attribute as a catcher was his pitch calling and that simply doesn't show up in the data.

Correct if I am wrong but framing is the difference between electronic out of zone and umpire call. If that is the case you are going to want Angel Hernandez making those calls so you are a framing god. 

[T.G.]

9 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Sort of like the Disarcina of catchers.

You just poked the 800lb gorilla... @Inside Pitch