Official 2022-23 Offseason Hot Stove Thread

[m0nkey]

I had no idea he was a FA

[Warfarin]

2 minutes ago, mmc said:

 

Given the spending they have done the last few days, I am guessing they maybe have found out that Bauer’s suspension will be upheld.

Also, this would seem to indicate that Justin Turner is not returning?

[UndertheHalo]

Seems like a good deal for the dodgers. 

[mmc]

 

[Inside Pitch]

23 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

To me, Brandon Drury is maybe their best option left in free agency.  If they can get him on a 2 or 3 year deal they’ll figure out a way to make him fit in the line up.  They can stick him at 2nd if things are fine with Rendon and Walsh.  Things probably won’t be fine with both of them.  He’s a reasonable major league bat.  Lack of these remains the Angels biggest immediate problem. 

Getting guys who best profile at 2B is sort of pointless.  Fletcher and Rengifo both profile better there.  I'd say Profar is an even better option than Drury but his career as a SS seemed to have been ended with the back to back shoulder blade injuries.  Drury/Profar are both better players, but someone like Andrus/Iglesias, as shitty as people may view them probably fit better as actual shortstops.

As has been the case all winter, Perry's best shot at improving is likely the trade market and I'd bet against a team like the Cubs moving anyone that could be seen as part of their immediate future.  

[UndertheHalo]

15 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Getting guys who best profile at 2B is sort of pointless.  Fletcher and Rengifo both profile better there.  I'd say Profar is an even better option than Drury but his career as a SS seemed to have been ended with the back to back shoulder blade injuries.  Drury/Profar are both better players, but someone like Andrus/Iglesias, as shitty as people may view them probably fit better as actual shortstops.

As has been the case all winter, Perry's best shot at improving is likely the trade market and I'd be against a team like the Cubs moving anyone that could be seen as part of their immediate future.  

But Drury is a much better bat than Fletcher and also they can stick him at 1B and 3B and I am fairly certain at least one of those will be a relevant issue.  Both may well be problems.  I just think the Angels haven’t done nearly enough upgrade the line up.  I don’t really regard Fletcher as a major league hitter at this point.  Urshela seems like a nice bench option with maybe some possibility find another gear in his game.  I just think Drury gives them insurance they really need.  Honestly if he’s a bit out of place at 2B then that would be a good thing for the Angels. 
 

as far as trades….I mean go with god Perry.  I hope he can get something done.  I am extremely skeptical. 

Edited December 18, 2022 by UndertheHalo

[Stradling]

Why do Angel fans downplay how good players are?  I have seen it on Twitter and I see it on here.  We call a guy like Urshela and Renfroe utility players or bench options, but they are coming off of seasons of 121 and 126 OPS+.  Have we done enough, no, but these are good additions. 

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, UndertheHalo said:

But Drury is a much better bat than Fletcher and also they can stick him at 1B and 3B and I am fairly certain at least one of those will be a relevant issue.  Both may well be problems.  I just think the Angels haven’t done nearly enough upgrade the line up.  I don’t really regard Fletcher as a major league hitter at this point.

I agree he's likely better but that's still a case of building depth at positions where they already have greater depth than at SS.   No shift next year -- I think they need to add someone who can actually play SS well.

6 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Urshela seems like a nice bench option with maybe some possibility find another gear in his game.  I just think Drury gives them insurance they really need.  Honestly if he’s a bit out of place at 2B then that would be a good thing for the Angels. 

Id argue Urshela is far more established than Drury at this point of their careers -- Drury's track record is kind of suspect.  Great 600+ PA's the last two years though.

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

Why do Angel fans downplay how good players are?  I have seen it on Twitter and I see it on here.  We call a guy like Urshela and Renfroe utility players or bench options, but they are coming off of seasons of 121 and 126 OPS+.  Have we done enough, no, but these are good additions. 

I’m a big fan of the Renfroe get.  I think that our starting outfielders as a unit represent likely a top 5 or even top 3 outfield in baseball.  I think Refroe is a good bat.  And it’s backed up with his career to date.  I said Urshela may have another gear.  I’m just less confident in him.  I think it’s a reasonable position.  The Angels just need more.  They needed a MI and it looks like they probably aren’t going to get a very good one.  I feel pretty good about Rengifo being pencilled in. Ideally he’s playing at 2B.  But if we have to shift him over to SS to get another decent bat in the line up then I think that’s probably a more desirable option then hoping Urshela will be enough.  Again.  I’m basing this on my lack of faith in Rendon and Walsh.  Not on my disappointment in Urshela - who I think is a fine addition to the team.  We just need more contingencies.  Like I said above.  I don’t think Fletcher should be playing very often.  He can’t hit.    

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

Id argue Urshela is far more established than Drury at this point of their careers -- Drury's track record is kind of suspect.  Great 600+ PA's the last two years though.

You may well be right here.  But I’m still going to take the position that right now - he’s among the better available outcomes for the Angels.  We just have to make the line up deeper.  The options are getting thinner. 

[Angels 1961]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

Why do Angel fans downplay how good players are?  I have seen it on Twitter and I see it on here.  We call a guy like Urshela and Renfroe utility players or bench options, but they are coming off of seasons of 121 and 126 OPS+.  Have we done enough, no, but these are good additions. 

They are very good additions for this year. If Rendon can play 125 to 135 games lineup will be very strong. Next off season will be in same boat looking for players do patch lineup again. I would like to see some players coming here that might stay a few years. I mentioned one in Vidal Brujan others out there. It seems rotation is going in right direction with others in minors to help soon. Position players need lot of work and besides O'Hoppe and Neto not much on farm. Jo Adell at 23 maybe he still has a chance to be one of those players. Again I bring up if this is Ohtani's last year with halos, will take time to recover from such a loss. 

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, UndertheHalo said:

You may well be right here.  But I’m still going to take the position that right now - he’s among the better available outcomes for the Angels.  We just have to make the line up deeper.  The options are getting thinner. 

The options are shit! 

If they are going to add redundant pieces Drury is fine.  But the FA options at SS are pretty much shit and their primary value would be the ability to adequately be able to play SS.

BTW -- wasn't saying you were wrong about anything.  Mostly arguing the FA options at SS are meh.

[UndertheHalo]

If Rendon is playing 125 games and slugging .380 again then it’s not going to be good.  

[jsnpritchett]

3 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I agree he's likely better but that's still a case of building depth at positions where they already have greater depth than at SS.   No shift next year -- I think they need to add someone who can actually play SS well.

Id argue Urshela is far more established than Drury at this point of their careers -- Drury's track record is kind of suspect.  Great 600+ PA's the last two years though.

Drury has already been with 7 organizations since he was drafted, with the potential to go to an 8th depending on who he signs with this off-season.  I know this opinion is in no way based in any sort of actual data, but I'm a little suspicious of guys who get moved around that frequently.  On the one hand, there's something about him that makes him at least mildly appealing--but on the other hand, no one seems to want to keep him around for very long once they get him. 

[Inside Pitch]

14 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Why do Angel fans downplay how good players are?  I have seen it on Twitter and I see it on here.  We call a guy like Urshela and Renfroe utility players or bench options, but they are coming off of seasons of 121 and 126 OPS+.  Have we done enough, no, but these are good additions. 

You know why.  Because Mike Trout.

Howie Kendrick was called the worst hitter in MLB by people on this board..  It's only gotten worse since then.

[Angels 1961]

1 minute ago, jsnpritchett said:

Drury has already been with 7 organizations since he was drafted, with the potential to go to an 8th depending on who he signs with this off-season.  I know this opinion is in no way based in any sort of actual data, but I'm a little suspicious of guys who get moved around that frequently.  On the one hand, there's something about him that makes him at least mildly appealing--but on the other hand, no one seems to want to keep him around for very long once they get him. 

Kinda like Hunter Renfroe, these are players that are just moved a lot. Bring value at trade deadline. Many players are moved a lot. 

[UndertheHalo]

3 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

Drury has already been with 7 organizations since he was drafted, with the potential to go to an 8th depending on who he signs with this off-season.  I know this opinion is in no way based in any sort of actual data, but I'm a little suspicious of guys who get moved around that frequently.  On the one hand, there's something about him that makes him at least mildly appealing--but on the other hand, no one seems to want to keep him around for very long once they get him. 

I just want to put it out there that I haven’t once mentioned Drury before today.  I bring him up solely because of the limited options remaining. 

[jsnpritchett]

Just now, UndertheHalo said:

I just want to put it out there that I haven’t once mentioned Drury before today.  I bring him up solely because of the limited options remaining. 

Oh, I know.  I'm not picking on you or anything.  I've been "meh" at best on him since he became a free agent.  But you're right that the free agent options aren't great, as I posted earlier.  Pickings are definitely slim.

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, jsnpritchett said:

Drury has already been with 7 organizations since he was drafted, with the potential to go to an 8th depending on who he signs with this off-season.  I know this opinion is in no way based in any sort of actual data, but I'm a little suspicious of guys who get moved around that frequently.  On the one hand, there's something about him that makes him at least mildly appealing--but on the other hand, no one seems to want to keep him around for very long once they get him. 

I'd put Drury into the whole "he should be better than he's been so we can maybe try to unlock him" category.  To be honest, a case could be made your suspicions are correct and that the teams that believed "we can fix him" found out he is what he is.

I'll readily admit there was a time when he was in AZ that I thought he had breakout potential or at the very least could be a Neil Walker type -- a good not great player.  A part me thinks he's got it in him to raise the bar, but I'm more suspect of it ever materializing these days.

[jsnpritchett]

3 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I'd put Drury into the whole "he should be better than he's been so we can maybe try to unlock him" category.  To be honest, a case could be made your suspicions are correct and that the teams that believed "we can fix him" found out he is what he is.

I'll readily admit there was a time when he was in AZ that I thought he had breakout potential or at the very least could be a Neil Walker type -- a good not great player.  A part me thinks he's got it in him to raise the bar, but I'm more suspect of it ever materializing these days.

Yeah, he'll be 31 late next season (he shares a birthdate with me, I just realized), so I think his '22 was probably about as good as he'll ever be--and even during this past season, he was pretty inconsistent from month to month.

Sure, he's better than someone like a Jack Mayfield or a Matt Duffy, so if he ends up with the Angels, it's not the worst thing in the world.  It's just so...meh.

[Second Base]

I think at this point, if you're going to go for it, you go for it. If you're going to punt on the season, then you punt. 

Playing the middle, doesn't seem like a recipe for success. It seems like a recipe for the Angels to be a slightly sub .500 team that ends up trading Ohtani, Renfroe and Urshela at the trade deadline.

Hoping to see Perry be bold, but not desperate. 

[ukyah]

1 hour ago, mmc said:

 

super good value, unless he's dead. i didn't pay any attention to his last season, but he must have been injured.

[jsnpritchett]

3 minutes ago, Second Base said:

I think at this point, if you're going to go for it, you go for it. If you're going to punt on the season, then you punt. 

Playing the middle, doesn't seem like a recipe for success. It seems like a recipe for the Angels to be a slightly sub .500 team that ends up trading Ohtani, Renfroe and Urshela at the trade deadline.

Hoping to see Perry be bold, but not desperate. 

That's exactly why I've been confused about what the strategy is for '23 (assuming there is one).  Signing the guys they've signed is a good start if there's something else coming.  If not, it pretty much assures mediocrity or slightly above.

[Warfarin]

Just now, ukyah said:

super good value, unless he's dead. i didn't pay any attention to his last season, but he must have been injured.

Their hitting coach is the guy he worked with to revamp his swing and resurrect his career years ago.  That connection probably led to him taking an undervalued deal to go to them.  Would not surprise me to see him post a significantly better year.

[Angels 1961]

Angel news today, they have kicked the tires on 45-year-old Rich Hill