Ruminations on the Middle Infield

[Jeff Fletcher]

It seems like Duffy now has fallen behind Mayfield on the middle infield depth chart and his only role is 1B v LHPs. I wonder if they would give more of a look to Ward for that? Or else just let Walsh see if he can figure out lefties. 

[HaloBronco]

1 hour ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

It seems like Duffy now has fallen behind Mayfield on the middle infield depth chart and his only role is 1B v LHPs. I wonder if they would give more of a look to Ward for that? Or else just let Walsh see if he can figure out lefties. 

I'd love to see them give Walsh more opportunities against lefties. 

It would also be improvement defensively because they really miss his glove when he's not in the lineup. He should have won a gold glove last year.   

[Angels 1961]

8 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

It seems like Duffy now has fallen behind Mayfield on the middle infield depth chart and his only role is 1B v LHPs. I wonder if they would give more of a look to Ward for that? Or else just let Walsh see if he can figure out lefties. 

 

8 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

It seems like Duffy now has fallen behind Mayfield on the middle infield depth chart and his only role is 1B v LHPs. I wonder if they would give more of a look to Ward for that? Or else just let Walsh see if he can figure out lefties. 

What happens when Fletcher comes back? Do Angels keep all INF? Duffy, Mayfield, Fletcher, Wade and Velazquez all stay? Does Fletcher have any trade value with his contract?

[totdprods]

Duffy may be getting less playing time because he has a guaranteed contract. 

It makes sense to ‘audition’ Wade, Mayfield, and Velazquez as much as possible because sooner or later, one of them or Rengifo probably needs to hit to waiver wire/get dealt. Duffy could be too, but he’s a bit more of a known commodity in terms of what they’ll get. That’s a lot of 2B/SS to carry on a 40-man.

[Angelsjunky]

32 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

 

What happens when Fletcher comes back? Do Angels keep all INF? Duffy, Mayfield, Fletcher, Wade and Velazquez all stay? Does Fletcher have any trade value with his contract?

As I said here or elsewhere, there's no reason why they can't keep all five on the roster, even when it reduces to 26. With a max of 13 pitchers, that's 13 position players: 2 catchers, 4 OF, 2 corner infielders, and 5 middle infielders. Unless they would prefer a fifth outfielder, third catcher, or call up someone like Rojas or Thaiss.

[Jeff Fletcher]

8 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

As I said here or elsewhere, there's no reason why they can't keep all five on the roster, even when it reduces to 26. With a max of 13 pitchers, that's 13 position players: 2 catchers, 4 OF, 2 corner infielders, and 5 middle infielders. Unless they would prefer a fifth outfielder, third catcher, or call up someone like Rojas or Thaiss.

You left out their pitcher/DH. He’s not going to count against the 13 pitcher limit. 
 

I don’t think they can keep 5 MIFs. If Fletcher comes back and no one else is hurt, I suspect that Velazquez goes down. Mayfield also has options. 
 

(Between now and May 2, they could keep all the MIFs and get rid of one reliever, but they may not want to do that since they are starting a big stretch with no off days.)
 

In a perfect world maybe Velazquez’s defense helps them more than Duffy’s offense, but it’s not a big enough difference to be worth losing Duffy. 
 

Also, I think they’re very reluctant to use Ward at 1B right now. Maybe if we see him working out there more.

Edited April 21, 2022 by Jeff Fletcher

[Angels 1961]

5 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

As I said here or elsewhere, there's no reason why they can't keep all five on the roster, even when it reduces to 26. With a max of 13 pitchers, that's 13 position players: 2 catchers, 4 OF, 2 corner infielders, and 5 middle infielders. Unless they would prefer a fifth outfielder, third catcher, or call up someone like Rojas or Thaiss.

Hard to find playing time for all of them. Duffy platoon at 1B but takes time away from Walsh. Mayfield can give Rendon rest at 3B once a week. I like Velaquez at SS and if Fletcher plays 2nd base and does not hit he could be odd man out.

[Angelsjunky]

1 minute ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

You left out their pitcher/DH. He’s not going to count against the 13 pitcher limit. 
 

I don’t think they can keep 5 MIFs. If Fletcher comes back and no one else is hurt, I suspect that Velazquez goes down. Mayfield also has options. 
 

In a perfect world maybe Velazquez’s defense helps them more than Duffy’s offense, but it’s not a big enough difference to be worth losing Duffy. 
 

Also, I think they’re very reluctant to use Ward at 1B right now. Maybe if we see him working out there more.

Ah, ok. I suppose they could go with 4 middle infielders and add a pitcher.

I suppose it comes down to Velazquez's bat. As great as his defense has been, I'm not sure the Angels will keep him up while hitting .150. Still, they're clearly giving him a full shake and obviously want him to break through. If he shows improvement, we might see Mayfield sent down.

[totdprods]

2 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

Ah, ok. I suppose they could go with 4 middle infielders and add a pitcher.

I suppose it comes down to Velazquez's bat. As great as his defense has been, I'm not sure the Angels will keep him up while hitting .150. Still, they're clearly giving him a full shake and obviously want him to break through. If he shows improvement, we might see Mayfield sent down.

With Ward back and Wade capable of spotting some time in OF, could also see Adell or Marsh go down if either really start to struggle. I wouldn't want that, but could be an option. 

[eligrba]

I really like Velazquez.  With his defense, he should be given lots of at bats.  He strikes me as a player who can be a game changer in ways that are not always obvious.

[Angels 1961]

4 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

Ah, ok. I suppose they could go with 4 middle infielders and add a pitcher.

I suppose it comes down to Velazquez's bat. As great as his defense has been, I'm not sure the Angels will keep him up while hitting .150. Still, they're clearly giving him a full shake and obviously want him to break through. If he shows improvement, we might see Mayfield sent down.

I thought only 13 pitchers after May were allowed. * in pen and 5 starters, halos get break because Ohtani does n ot count as pitcher.

[Angels 1961]

38 minutes ago, eligrba said:

I really like Velazquez.  With his defense, he should be given lots of at bats.  He strikes me as a player who can be a game changer in ways that are not always obvious.

I agree Velazquez reminds me of Joe Koppe great fielder but never could hit.

[Angelsjunky]

9 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

I thought only 13 pitchers after May were allowed. * in pen and 5 starters, halos get break because Ohtani does n ot count as pitcher.

Yes, but as Jeff Fletcher said, before Ohtani is a two-way player, he doesn't count as one of the 13 max...or at least that's the implication I got. Meaning, they could have Ohtani + 13 other pitchers.

[Angelsjunky]

48 minutes ago, eligrba said:

I really like Velazquez.  With his defense, he should be given lots of at bats.  He strikes me as a player who can be a game changer in ways that are not always obvious.

Yes, agreed. 

I'm not suggesting that Velazquez is anything close to Ozzie Smith, but if you look at his stats, the Wizard didn't surpass the 100 wRC+ (league average) watermark until his age 30 season, and then he was a solidly average plus hitter for eight out of the next nine years.

Now Smith was a decent hitter before then, but he had some truly bad years. His second year, 1979, he hit .211/.260/.262 with a 47 wRC+, but the Cardinals played him anyway - and he still managed 0.7 WAR. Not great, but not horrible. A year later he was still at a poor 77 wRC+ but with 4.0 WAR due to his incredible defense.

Andrelton Simmons also improved with the bat from his early 20s to his mid/late 20s.

My point being is two-fold:

One, even with bad hitting, Velazquez could be a plus, in terms of WAR.

Two, Velazquez could be a late-bloomer with the bat. Defense-first players sometimes fill out their offensive potential later on (common with catchers).

So it really comes down to how bad Velazquez's bat is, and whether or not the Angels are willing to carry it for his defense. If most everyone else is hitting, it might be worth carrying an "automatic out."

 

[T.G.]

36 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

So it really comes down to how bad Velazquez's bat is, and whether or not the Angels are willing to carry it for his defense. If most everyone else is hitting, it might be worth carrying an "automatic out."

[Angelsjunky]

10 minutes ago, True Grich said:

There he is. Of course good old Mathis never played in more than 94 games, or had more than 328 PA (both in 2008). He was basically a half-time player for his career, which isn't uncommon at the catcher position, much rarer at other positions.

It is still crazy to think that Mathis played in 17 seasons. Who knows, maybe he'll make a comeback and play this year. I wonder how his knees are (@tdawg87, don't).

[Angels 1961]

1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

Yes, but as Jeff Fletcher said, before Ohtani is a two-way player, he doesn't count as one of the 13 max...or at least that's the implication I got. Meaning, they could have Ohtani + 13 other pitchers.

I know 8 in BP plus Thor, Lorenzen, Suarez, Sandoval and Dermers. So you can carry 7 INF 4 OF and 2 catchers.

[Pancake Bear]

Should be Mayfield sent down, imo. He's off to a hot start and he had a ridiculous WPA last year with his ridiculously timely hitting, so everyone loves him, but the overall numbers last year were bad and he's likely to cool off this year also. I just don't feel the love, tbh. 

[Angelsjunky]

1 hour ago, Angels 1961 said:

I know 8 in BP plus Thor, Lorenzen, Suarez, Sandoval and Dermers. So you can carry 7 INF 4 OF and 2 catchers.

You're not including Ohtani. He'd either take the spot of one of the IF or relievers.

Meaning, it will be:

2 C, 4 OF, Ohtani + 5 starters

And one of the following two options:

• 8 relievers and 6 infielders
• 7 relievers and 7 infielders

I was initially thinking the latter, but Jeff Fletcher implied the former might be the route they go. Meaning, one of Mayfield or Velazquez is demoted once David Fletcher gets back.

Edited April 21, 2022 by Angelsjunky

[Tank]

my wife and daughter are both pretty insistent that the halos keep wade on the big club. i mean like pitchforks and torches kind of insistent.

and i'm beginning to become highly suspicious that it has little to do with his play on the field at this point, either.

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by Tank

[HaloSpurs]

1 hour ago, Pancake Bear said:

Should be Mayfield sent down, imo. He's off to a hot start and he had a ridiculous WPA last year with his ridiculously timely hitting, so everyone loves him, but the overall numbers last year were bad and he's likely to cool off this year also. I just don't feel the love, tbh. 

I think this is where I’m at as well. Squid brings the best defense. Wades speed is great to have around, seems to make stuff happen and useful as a pinch runner, and Duffy is the best hitter among them. Mayfield the odd one out for me although definitely concerned about Fletch 

[Angelsjunky]

I wish the Angels had the balls to send Fletcher to AAA to work on his plate approach. They could mask it with the comment, "We just want you to get into a good rhythm and gain confidence before facing big league pitching again."

Of course they won't do that, because Fletcher is The Guy.

[greginpsca]

Velasquez should be the ss. That is the one position the team can afford to be an offensive hole.  His defense is far above the others. Wade should be the utility guy, and Fletcher at 2nd base. Option Mayfield, and trade Duffy.

[Jeff Fletcher]

3 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

Yes, but as Jeff Fletcher said, before Ohtani is a two-way player, he doesn't count as one of the 13 max...or at least that's the implication I got. Meaning, they could have Ohtani + 13 other pitchers.

This is correct

They will have 6 starters (including Ohtani) and 8 relievers.

That leaves 12 position players: 2 catchers, 6 infielders, 4 outfielders.

 

[BTH]

8 minutes ago, greginpsca said:

Velasquez should be the ss. That is the one position the team can afford to be an offensive hole.  His defense is far above the others. Wade should be the utility guy, and Fletcher at 2nd base. Option Mayfield, and trade Duffy.

If Velazquez is at SS and Fletcher is at 2B, that's two positions that'll be offensive holes.