OC Register: Angels’ Patrick Sandoval suffers potentially season-ending lower back injury

[AngelsWin.com]

One of the Angels’ few feel-good stories of 2021 might have reached an early ending.

Pitcher Patrick Sandoval, the 24-year-old from Mission Viejo who shined in his first extended run in the starting rotation, has a potentially season-ending lower back injury. The Angels placed Sandoval on the 10-day injured list Wednesday with a left lumbar spine stress reaction.

Addressing reporters before Wednesday’s game in Detroit, Manager Joe Maddon said the injury took him by surprise. That suggests Sandoval was hurt after his most recent start last Friday in Anaheim, in which the left-hander allowed four runs in 4 ⅔ innings against the Houston Astros.

Sandoval was scheduled to start Thursday against the Tigers. Veteran left-hander Jose Quintana will start the game instead.

Quintana has been pitching out of the bullpen since June. He hasn’t thrown more than three innings in a game since May. With a “bullpen game” likely Thursday, the Angels recalled pitchers Aaron Slegers and Andrew Wantz from Triple-A Salt Lake. They also optioned right-hander James Hoyt to Salt Lake.

Sandoval’s stay on the 10-day injured list is retroactive to Sunday. Teams cannot backdate injured list stints more than three days.

For Sandoval, it’s a disappointing setback amid a promising year. He began the regular season at the Angels’ alternate training site, was recalled on May 3, and two weeks later was promoted to the team’s starting rotation. He threw no fewer than five innings a start in 12 consecutive games before Friday, posting a 3.04 earned-run average during that span. Overall Sandoval is 3-6 with a 3.62 ERA.

The Angels have diligently maintained a six- or seven-man rotation most of the season. Because of the off-days on their calendar, they won’t need a sixth starter until Sept. 6 if they intend to keep Shohei Ohtani, Dylan Bundy, Jose Suarez, Jaime Barría and Reid Detmers on regular rest.

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[totdprods]

One of the biggest bummers here is even though a lot of our starters have performed well, every single guy we'd like to see in '22 has something legitimate in which to be concerned with...

Canning, Rodriguez, Sandoval all have had substantial injuries. 
Ohtani has been the most durable but easily has the most taxing workload of any pitcher. 
Detmers is still completely unproven despite strong results. 
Suarez is really the only 'stable' SP at this point and he's still pretty unproven/mixed results starting. Barria slots in here too, but he's hardly had an opportunity. 
And if we even entertained bringing back Cobb, Bundy, or Quintana, each had their own injury/effectiveness issues. 

Sandoval was ideally gonna be that guy who was healthy and effective all year and could be counted on 100% to go right into 2022 as someone to be relied on, and while this will likely be healed up by then, it does trigger a little bit of durability concern.

The Angels definitely needed to add one SP this winter, and could maybe get by with what they had internally. Sandoval's injury might make two arms a necessity just to build that safety net.

[Dtwncbad]

I normally would cringe at the idea of signing a 37 year old starter, but if I look at the projected 2022 roster I am very interested in getting Scherzer.

Even if he regresses to be a little less dominant, he would be such a great fit.

Veteran leader, total bulldog, gritty demeanor, ultimate competitor, fearless, knows how to pitch, knows how to trust his stuff. . .  You can go on and on.

You can at least imagine how this next crop of young pitchers could respond and elevate their game seeing first hand how this guy operates.

 

[T.G.]

 I blame AJ

[tdawg87]

We definitely need another starter. And not a 1-year Quintana BS. 

[Slegnaac]

19 minutes ago, True Grich said:

 I blame AJ

Back problems originated with Bobby?

[ten ocho recon scout]

Sigh.... for realz?

[totdprods]

42 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

We definitely need another starter. And not a 1-year Quintana BS. 

Nah, they work out sometimes. One-year deals for Alex Wood, Anthony DeSclafani, Robbie Ray, Charlie Morton all panned out.

I actually think their second SP acquisition should be another one-year deal guy. Bring in a a mid-range or frontline arm via FA or trade for your first big acquisition, then an affordable one-year guy to shore up the rotation. Someone easily cut or moved to bullpen if kids push him out of the way.

I would've agreed either of the last couple offseasons, but we have too many good, young, MLB-ready arms this year and next to risk clogging up a couple spots in the rotation. 

Edited August 19, 2021 by totdprods

[fan_since79]

Mark Langston suggested that the Angels' players (pitchers included) should take a look at Ohtani's training regimen. Shohei is getting stronger as the season goes on. He's doing something right. They should adopt his routine. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

2 minutes ago, fan_since79 said:

Mark Langston suggested that the Angels' players (pitchers included) should take a look at Ohtani's training regimen. Shohei is getting stronger as the season goes on. He's doing something right. They should adopt his routine. 

Its his diet. Fish is really good for you.

 

[Slegnaac]

2 hours ago, True Grich said:

 I blame AJ

Grich is the first Angels player I remember having back problems.

[HeavenlyHalos]

Need to sign two starters as we have way too many guys with injury concerns and/or have never pitched that many innings in a season.

[UndertheHalo]

Wtf.  Feels bad, man. 

[greginpsca]

5 hours ago, Slegnaac said:

Grich is the first Angels player I remember having back problems.

He did that lifting an air conditioner.

[tdawg87]

7 hours ago, totdprods said:

Nah, they work out sometimes. One-year deals for Alex Wood, Anthony DeSclafani, Robbie Ray, Charlie Morton all panned out.

I actually think their second SP acquisition should be another one-year deal guy. Bring in a a mid-range or frontline arm via FA or trade for your first big acquisition, then an affordable one-year guy to shore up the rotation. Someone easily cut or moved to bullpen if kids push him out of the way.

I would've agreed either of the last couple offseasons, but we have too many good, young, MLB-ready arms this year and next to risk clogging up a couple spots in the rotation. 

Did those deals pan out for the Angels?

I'm a pessimist by nature and have become absolutely jaded over the last 7 years. 

I think we're jumping the gun a bit with Sandoval, Suarez, Barria, Detmers, and C-Rod. 

2 of those guys have back injuries and may not pitch again this year. How will that impact 2022? C-Rod missed 2 years due to back injuries. We'll have to wait to see the severity of Sandoval's injury, I suppose. But even if he's healthy, I think we saw him pitch like an ace for a month and suddenly decided we have a hidden gem in the rotation. I do believe Sandoval will be a staple in the rotation for a while but he's not a #1 or even a #2 guy. He's a good mid-rotation starter. Maybe even very good. 

Suarez, IMO, is better suited for the bullpen. Pens need guys who can pitch 3 innings no problem but also make emergency starts. That's what I see him as.

Barria has no options left, so the Angels have a decision to make with him in 2022. Is he worth a rotation spot? A bullpen gig? Idk, but there's question marks and clearly the team has never been high on him so most likely he'll be traded or non-tendered or whateverthefuck.

Detmers is legit. BUT, he's young and is going to take his lumps. He certainly has already. He's not going to be a #2 guy next year.

C-Rod? Dude can't stay healthy. He could be an excellent starter, but I'm starting to think he'll end up in the bullpen.

And as for Ohtani, you're seeing the best pitching performance of his entire career by far. Can he repeat that?

Ultimately I think we have a potentially lethal rotation. Emphasis on "potentially". I use the Dodgers as an example. They had a legit rotation, then they signed Bauer (lol). Then they traded for Scherzer. Even without those guys they have a playoff level rotation. 

If we can add a legitimate frontline starter to the mix we have a very good rotation on paper, and potentially one of the best in baseball.

Signing another lottery ticket or taking a flyer is the same shit we've been doing for 9 years. How has that worked out? 

Let's change the formula. Instead of signing a big name SS, how about we get Stroman or make a significant trade? Go into the season with something GOOD on paper for once. Instead of "well this could be great if everyone stays healthy and everything goes right", we get "holy shit this rotation is great and could be fucking ridiculous".

[Inside Pitch]

5 hours ago, Slegnaac said:

Grich is the first Angels player I remember having back problems.

So, no lifting air conditioners .... Problem solved.

[UndertheHalo]

I’ve always found the Angels seemingly cool view of Barria as sort of baffling.  How much money and time have the Angels wasted on guys probably worse that Barria.  I don’t see why Barria can’t be a reasonably reliable like 5 starter for them.  Which is a thing they’ve struggled to have.  It’s pretty annoying if you think about it.  

Edited August 19, 2021 by UndertheHalo

[totdprods]

26 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Did those deals pan out for the Angels?

I'm a pessimist by nature and have become absolutely jaded over the last 7 years. 

I think we're jumping the gun a bit with Sandoval, Suarez, Barria, Detmers, and C-Rod. 

Oh dude, you won't get anything but agreement with me. The last time we had a talented bunch of young arms and we relied on them to hold down a rotation we saw Richards, Heaney, Skaggs, Trop, JC Ramirez, etc. they all went down with injury. 

I LOVE what we have right now, but now that Sandoval has hit a snag health-wise - regardless if all these guys are 100% healthy come ST 2022 - they need to add two MLB arms to the rotation just to offer some semblance of durability. And because we have so many good young arms, I'm fine with one of those acquisitions being a guy on a one-year deal or a trade acquisition with one year of control. I almost want someone who will be easy to shift to the pen or cut ties should a youngster emerge as ready for that spot. 

And I think a trade is a great way to land one of those arms still, but I'm starting to lean towards keeping Marsh and Adell, making a big impact trade really unlikely. I've always said good teams have good depth and if that means guys like Detmers, Rodriguez, Suarez, Bachman, Canning, and Barria start the year in the pen or AAA (some can, some can't), it's only a good thing. Literally the only reason we've survived this year actually. 

I really like Suarez and one of Rodriguez/Bachman in the pen, FWIW, at least to open the year. I wish they'd trade Canning while he has value but that's looking grim. Detmers and Sandoval are the only young arms I'd entrust a rotation spot to 100% without question going into '22.Anyone else who might think our '22 rotation will be Ohtani, Sandoval, Suarez, Detmers, Barria, and an acquisition and to be satisfied with that is super reckless.

[totdprods]

32 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I’ve always found the Angels seemingly cool view of Barria as sort of baffling.  How much money and time have the Angels wasted on guys probably worse that Barria.  I don’t see why Barria can’t be a reasonably reliable like 5 starter for them.  Which is a thing they’ve struggled to have.  It’s pretty annoying if you think about it.  

I'll never understand it. The only reason I can think of is he (or the Angels believe) really hits a wall after facing a line-up more than twice through and they just never have the bullpen depth to count on him every few days in a rotation.

[arch stanton]

20 hours ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Its his diet. Fish is really good for you.

 

You trying to give the whole team Mercury poisoning?

[Angel Oracle]

On 8/19/2021 at 7:39 AM, Dtwncbad said:

I normally would cringe at the idea of signing a 37 year old starter, but if I look at the projected 2022 roster I am very interested in getting Scherzer.

Even if he regresses to be a little less dominant, he would be such a great fit.

Veteran leader, total bulldog, gritty demeanor, ultimate competitor, fearless, knows how to pitch, knows how to trust his stuff. . .  You can go on and on.

You can at least imagine how this next crop of young pitchers could respond and elevate their game seeing first hand how this guy operates.

 

Could be a good two years plus team option idea?  Team option mainly to add a few million buyout dollars?

By 2024, the youngsters should have fully emerged anyway.

For 2022-23: Ohtani, Scherzer, Sandoval, Cobb, Detmers, and Canning

For 2024: Ohtani, Detmers, Bachman, Sandoval, Canning, and Bush

Move Suarez to the pen.

[Revad]

58 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Could be a good two years plus team option idea?  Team option mainly to add a few million buyout dollars?

By 2024, the youngsters should have fully emerged anyway.

For 2022-23: Ohtani, Scherzer, Sandoval, Cobb, Detmers, and Canning

For 2024: Ohtani, Detmers, Bachman, Sandoval, Canning, and Bush

Move Suarez to the pen.

I’d love to see it, but If you add in a closer and shortstop and Arte would have to cut haughty yacht fuel costs, and we don’t want him overextended in that way.

[Dtwncbad]

On 8/19/2021 at 10:18 AM, Slegnaac said:

Grich is the first Angels player I remember having back problems.

He probably hurt his back drilling chicks from Huntington Beach.  Dude was a playa.

[Angel Oracle]

On 8/19/2021 at 8:28 AM, fan_since79 said:

Mark Langston suggested that the Angels' players (pitchers included) should take a look at Ohtani's training regimen. Shohei is getting stronger as the season goes on. He's doing something right. They should adopt his routine. 

He’s also seemingly adopted the Verlander strategy (without the putz persona).

Start off 93-95, and then by the 5th-6th innings start cranking it up to 97-99.

His pitch counts are sick the past 6 starts, 93 pitch average on 6 2/3 innings average.

[greginpsca]

On 8/19/2021 at 4:25 PM, totdprods said:

I'll never understand it. The only reason I can think of is he (or the Angels believe) really hits a wall after facing a line-up more than twice through and they just never have the bullpen depth to count on him every few days in a rotation.

Sandoval had trouble facing a lineup the 2nd time around when he first came up.  It is something young pitchers have to work on, or else they go to the pen. I don't think i would be upset having Suarez & Barria as the #5 & 6 in the rotation next season. Unless PM has a better & cheaper plan.