Race to oblivion ! Afghanistan vs. South Vietnam edition

[UndertheHalo]

Trump wanted to do the withdrawal and he did 90% of the work to make that happen.  But in the end he’s a fucking deep state cuck and he pussied out.  He didn’t want to make the beautiful generals mad at him.  He let them convince him that he would look like a loser.  For Trump there’s nothing worse !  There’s no way to do this “right” it was going to go to hell in the end no matter what.  That’s the reality of all this.  

[UndertheHalo]

The second that people realized that the US presence actually was ending there was going to be chaos no matter when it happened. 

[Jay]

3 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

The second that people realized that the US presence actually was ending there was going to be chaos no matter when it happened. 

Yes but chaos at the coffee shop isn't the same as chaos at the airport.

 

[Blarg]

3 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

The second that people realized that the US presence actually was ending there was going to be chaos no matter when it happened. 

Oh come on, this isn't like they declared a pull out of troops last week. This was a known withdrawal with a fixed date for a damn long time and yet like a bunch of lazy students they put off the logistics and coordination until the last minute.

All US representatives and citizens should have been off that piece of dirt in April. Any Afghanistan refugees vetted and removed by July. Mop up of equipment should have been consistent through the slow withdrawal from outposts. 

This is a top down clusterfuck. 

[UndertheHalo]

4 minutes ago, Jay said:

Yes but chaos at the coffee shop isn't the same as chaos at the airport.

 

They were going to freak out and it was going to happen somewhere.  And it’s just baffling how you think Trump would have done it right.  What on earth makes you think that ? As we all know.  The Trump administration was famous for details.  The same people organizing this for Biden would have been organizing it for Trump.  Get it through your head.  Those people don’t want to fucking leave. 

[UndertheHalo]

Just now, Blarg said:

Oh come on, this isn't like they declared a pull out of troops last week. This was a known withdrawal with a fixed date for a damn long time and yet like a bunch of lazy students they put off the logistics and coordination until the last minute.

All US representatives and citizens should have been off that piece of dirt in April. Any Afghanistan refugees vetted and removed by July. Mop up of equipment should have been consistent through the slow withdrawal from outposts. 

This is a top down clusterfuck. 

But they weren’t.  Who do you think those people were ? The ones that just couldn’t fucking leave until the last absolute second ? Also they have gotten a huge number of them out.  You just want to pin the guy.  Fine I get it.  

[Jay]

3 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

They were going to freak out and it was going to happen somewhere.  And it’s just baffling how you think Trump would have done it right.  What on earth makes you think that ? As we all know.  The Trump administration was famous for details.  The same people organizing this for Biden would have been organizing it for Trump.  Get it through your head.  Those people don’t want to fucking leave. 

Literally anybody could have done it better. Even @tdawg87 could have done it better.

[Blarg]

You just want to excuse Biden from not taking responsibility for fucking this up. He had a deadline and didn't move on it until it became a humanitarian crisis. He is incompetent. 

[UndertheHalo]

Just now, Jay said:

Literally anybody could have done it better. Even @tdawg87 could have done it better.

Maybe dude.  Maybe. 

[Blarg]

Also, there is no reason helicopters full of money should have left with the corrupt government leaders that did get out first. That money should have been confiscated, it wasn't theirs. 

[UndertheHalo]

Just now, Blarg said:

You just want to excuse Biden from not taking responsibility for fucking this up. He had a deadline and didn't move on it until it became a humanitarian crisis. He is incompetent. 

Well think what you wanna think man.  It doesn’t matter.  I’m pretty sure grandpa Joe hasn’t lost a supporter in you or anything.    Enjoy San Diego.  

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, Blarg said:

Also, there is no reason helicopters full of money should have left with the corrupt government leaders that did get out first. That money should have been confiscated, it wasn't theirs. 

Haha weird huh !?

Edited August 28, 2021 by UndertheHalo

[tdawg87]

Yes, a 375 pound man from a baseball message board could have done better.

You guys are ridiculous.

[Jay]

Just now, tdawg87 said:

Yes, a 375 pound man from a baseball message board could have done better.

You guys are ridiculous.

I should have said, "anyone with a brain in his head could have done better."

[Kevin]

If you were a U.S. citizen hanging around Afghanistan for the last year and didn't see the writing on the wall (especially with the U.S. withdrawing troops and the Taliban taking over territory from an inept government) you bear some responsibility. I get that some of those people were doing humanitarian work, which is noble but the jig was up. As late as August 7th and again on the 12th, while the last shreds of whatever we built for the last twenty years was hanging on by a thread, the embassy was saying to get out and even willing to pay for your flight. 

I know some have been critical about announcing a withdrawal date but can you imagine how many more people would be screwed if it wasn't? 

[Crampknees]

1 minute ago, Jay said:

I should have said, "anyone without an brain in his head empty thought bubble could have done better."

 

[Kotchman]

2 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

They were going to freak out and it was going to happen somewhere.  And it’s just baffling how you think Trump would have done it right.  What on earth makes you think that ? As we all know.  The Trump administration was famous for details.  The same people organizing this for Biden would have been organizing it for Trump.  Get it through your head.  Those people don’t want to fucking leave. 

One major difference is we had military leaders resign over policy disagreements with Trump. Not a one of the deep state bastards resigned prior to this abortion. Military leadership either presented this plan or were willing  participants. All this Trump blame is misplaced. If Trump doesn’t challenge  the status quo in Afghanistan , we aren’t having a withdrawal conversation  today. Instead it’s business as usual over there. So yes Trump forced Biden and the military’s hands, but all they had to do was execute a withdrawal. It’s obvious they had no intentions to evacuate civilians because they didn’t do it gradually. Seems more likely civilians weren’t in the plan until it became a PR nightmare 

[Jason]

59 minutes ago, Jay said:

Biden got a lot of bad advice and the result is a disaster.

I wish Biden were smarter but he isn't.

There will be a lot of hearings/investigations into this. Hopefully some heads will roll.

 

That’s not going to happen 

[UndertheHalo]

7 minutes ago, Kotchman said:

One major difference is we had military leaders resign over policy disagreements with Trump. Not a one of the deep state bastards resigned prior to this abortion. Military leadership either presented this plan or were willing  participants. All this Trump blame is misplaced. If Trump doesn’t challenge  the status quo in Afghanistan , we aren’t having a withdrawal conversation  today. Instead it’s business as usual over there. So yes Trump forced Biden and the military’s hands, but all they had to do was execute a withdrawal. It’s obvious they had no intentions to evacuate civilians because they didn’t do it gradually. Seems more likely civilians weren’t in the plan until it became a PR nightmare 

I think you’re really selling short how difficult a withdrawal actually is.  Particularly one that’s under fire.  And look, other than not actually finishing the job I think Trump did  well to nearly end this.  I’ve said that many times.  I don’t blame Trump for the mess today.  I haven’t said that once.  I don’t blame Biden either.  I do give him credit for for being willing to take the political hit to actually do it.

and I keep asking.  Just who do you guys think it was that was still in the country ? I have my suspicions.  I think it’s security contractors.  Guys getting paid an incredible amount of money to be there.  Also, people responsible for some of the most heinous shit to happen in Afghanistan.  I’m not exactly sorry for these people.  You think they actually wanted to leave ?

Edited August 28, 2021 by UndertheHalo

[Kotchman]

1 minute ago, UndertheHalo said:

I think you’re really selling sort how difficult a withdrawal actually is.  Particularly one that’s under fire.  And look, other than not actually finishing the job I think Trump did  well to nearly end this.  I’ve said that many times.  I don’t blame Trump for the mess today.  I haven’t said that once.  I don’t blame Biden either.  I do give him credit for for being willing to take the political hit to actually do it.

I don’t believe Biden volunteered. He was likely told to be the fall guy. My guess the dems are trying to walk a tightrope by allowing Biden to own all the failures without damaging the 2024 ticket. That ticket will expose who is really running the show now 

[UndertheHalo]

23 minutes ago, Kevin said:

If you were a U.S. citizen hanging around Afghanistan for the last year and didn't see the writing on the wall (especially with the U.S. withdrawing troops and the Taliban taking over territory from an inept government) you bear some responsibility. I get that some of those people were doing humanitarian work, which is noble but the jig was up. As late as August 7th and again on the 12th, while the last shreds of whatever we built for the last twenty years was hanging on by a thread, the embassy was saying to get out and even willing to pay for your flight. 

I know some have been critical about announcing a withdrawal date but can you imagine how many more people would be screwed if it wasn't? 

And it’s not like they kept a tight schedule ! It was supposed to end in May and Biden extended it.  They left Bagram in the middle of the night without telling anyone lol. 

Edited August 28, 2021 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

3 minutes ago, Kotchman said:

I don’t believe Biden volunteered. He was likely told to be the fall guy. My guess the dems are trying to walk a tightrope by allowing Biden to own all the failures without damaging the 2024 ticket. That ticket will expose who is really running the show now 

Maybe, but also consider that Biden ked the faction (mostly just him) that wanted out in 2011.  Obama declined to follow his advice and deployed more troops.  Biden does have a history being for withdrawal going back to that time. 

Edited August 28, 2021 by UndertheHalo

[AngelsLakersFan]

38 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

But they weren’t.  Who do you think those people were ? The ones that just couldn’t fucking leave until the last absolute second ? Also they have gotten a huge number of them out.  You just want to pin the guy.  Fine I get it.  

As much as I think it's fair to say this was going to end up a clusterfuck no matter what, I don't think that excuses people from being blamed for it being a clusterfuck. 

[tdawg87]

1 minute ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

As much as I think it's fair to say this was going to end up a clusterfuck no matter what, I don't think that excuses people from being blamed for it being a clusterfuck. 

I agree.

[AngelsLakersFan]

8 hours ago, arch stanton said:

I'm pretty sure we're clearing out of Afghanistan to make way for our next adventure in bringing freedom to an oppressed people. Destination not yet clear but as you look around the world there's plenty of candidates

 

8 hours ago, Don said:

Zero of course. We gotta murder some freedom into new peeps now. 

So if we are still going to be spending the money to bring some freedom to some new people, what exactly was the point of leaving Afghanistan?