Trumped

[arch stanton]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

It's odd to me that the president, congress, the NRA and a gun are getting more blame for this than the shooter. 

He was only angry because he had access to a gun. The campus was left unsecured because he had access to a gun. The only possible action available is the one that’s virtually impossible to take 

[Jason]

4 minutes ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

The shooter should never had had a gun in the first place, if Congress had done it's job. Or if Trump hadn't repealed the Obama rule calling for backup checks to make sure people with mental problems couldn't legally obtain an assault riffle. They still haven't banned bump stocks after the worst mass shooting in American history in Las Vegas.

How many deaths will it take to realize that too many have died? - Bob Dylan...

The answer is blowin' in the wind.

What do these have to do with the Florida shooting? 

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

1 minute ago, Jason said:

What do these have to do with the Florida shooting? 

The Shooter had a MENTAL Problem, and they might have prevented him from buying a gun if Trump hadn't repealed the regulation for the background check, Geez

Why are not seeing what most people see.

[Taylor]

It's funny how gun buffs suddenly become passionate about advocating for mental illness following a mass shooting.

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, Taylor said:

It's funny how gun buffs suddenly become passionate about advocating for mental illness following a mass shooting.

Vigorously arguing against restrictions on mentally ill people just a few months ago.  On this forum. 

[Spirit]

I didn't realize the ACLU posted on this forum.

That's awesome!

 

 

[UndertheHalo]

this is a shockingly horrifying message from the president.  Even for Trump. 

Edited February 18, 2018 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

6 minutes ago, Geoff said:

I didn't realize the ACLU posted on this forum.

That's awesome!

 

 

Definitely strange bed fellows. 

[the dude abides]

 

[Tank]

58 minutes ago, Jason said:

It's odd to me that the president, congress, the NRA and a gun are getting more blame for this than the shooter. 

Can we agree that there are multiple things involved in this issue and that this was not an isolated or unique event? There's not one single problem alone to solve here.

[InsideThePark]

2 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

this is a shockingly horrifying message from the president.  Even for Trump. 

Apparently he watched Fox News all day yesterday and tweeted some of their far-right talking points, including this one. He's not happy about the indictments.

It's a shame that there isn't an additional, more moderate right-wing news channel in the mainstream. Fox News, for the most part (although not entirely), is more batshit crazy than it's ever been in spreading propaganda, and that's obviously saying something. If they're not floating conspiracy theories, they're over-reaching or conflating completely separate issues, as seen in the above tweet.

[Jason]

4 hours ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

The Shooter had a MENTAL Problem, and they might have prevented him from buying a gun if Trump hadn't repealed the regulation for the background check, Geez

Why are not seeing what most people see.

The EO that Trump axed had nothing to do with whatever issues this kid had. 

http://fortune.com/2018/02/15/trump-shooting-mental-illness/

[Jason]

3 hours ago, Tank said:

Can we agree that there are multiple things involved in this issue and that this was not an isolated or unique event? There's not one single problem alone to solve here.

I agree but the only stuff I see on the news puts almost zero accountability on the shooter. Hell, they make the FBI sound more evil than this kid.

[Jason]

3 hours ago, Taylor said:

It's funny how gun buffs suddenly become passionate about advocating for mental illness following a mass shooting.

It's much more than mentally ill people. We've had mentally ill people for a long time. We now live in a culture that celebrates and is entertained by gratuitous violence and has no respect for human life. Just focusing on the mentally ill will not change that. 

[Jason]

3 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

this is a shockingly horrifying message from the president.  Even for Trump. 

It's idiotic. Like the Miami office is worried about his stupid problems. He has no ability to remain silent

[Jason]

3 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

Definitely strange bed fellows. 

I remember when they backed Limbaugh with his prescription pill ordeal. 

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

42 minutes ago, Jason said:

It's much more than mentally ill people. We've had mentally ill people for a long time. We now live in a culture that celebrates and is entertained by gratuitous violence and has no respect for human life. Just focusing on the mentally ill will not change that. 

I think social media and technology in general also plays a part.  For the record I'm not blaming either because like anything in life it's how you use (or abuse) it but it gives people the ultimate 'pay attention to me' platform.  Look no further than the president who constantly does the impossible and tries to make any situation about him or to his advantage.  People doing ridiculous, stupid, dangerous and violent things for attention isn't anything new but now the moment it happens it's everywhere.  Any time something happens the person who first posts the video, tweets it or whatever gets recognition and rather than do what's right too many watching would rather record it while it happens.  Some time back there was a man who had mental issues who walked into a body of water to drown himself while some kids recorded it.  All the while they yelled that they weren't going to help him and they were laughing about the whole thing as it happened.  There's no way for those kids to know what state of mind he's in but to sit there and not only watch that but laugh about it tells me there's something seriously wrong with those involved.  Back in 2010 when Billy Nye fainted while giving a speech at USC comments were made about how little people responded because they were more interested in recording it or reporting it through social media.

I think what some people value in general is just really out of whack with what people used to value.  It also makes it a lot easier for people to find others who may think like them and in some cases you've got younger people who really haven't had a chance to form their own opinion getting sucked into something that maybe isn't for them.  Again that's nothing new but I think it makes it easier for stronger people to take advantage of weaker people, think gangs finding new recruits where they prey on kids with no support system at home.  I'm just glad I came of age before social media got real big but at the same time it scares the crap out of me when it comes to having kids of my own. 

      

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

The EO that Trump axed had nothing to do with whatever issues this kid had. 

http://fortune.com/2018/02/15/trump-shooting-mental-illness/

YEAH YEAH YEAH. Everyone is wrong. So where do we go from here. Apparently they don't want Trump's prays and well wishes anymore, and they need more than a moment of silence from Congress.

These mass shootings are out of control. They are becoming more frequent all the time. But the silence from Washington is deafening. Congress debates guns after every shooting and then go back to doing the same old thing; nothing, nothing at all...

[Jason]

1 minute ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

YEAH YEAH YEAH. Everyone is wrong. So where do we go from here. Apparently they don't want Trump's prays and well wishes anymore, and they need more than a moment of silence. These mass shootings are out of control. They are becoming more frequent all the time. But the silence from Washington is deafening. Congress debates guns after every shooting and then go back to doing the same old thing; nothing, nothing at all...

Obviously there has to be some things they can all agree on that will help. What, specifically, would you like congress to do or enact? Personally, I'd like to see strict enforcement of laws we already have. Maybe that would be a good start. Enacting laws won't help if there is no follow through

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

5 minutes ago, Jason said:

Obviously there has to be some things they can all agree on that will help. What, specifically, would you like congress to do or enact? Personally, I'd like to see strict enforcement of laws we already have. Maybe that would be a good start. Enacting laws won't help if there is no follow through

Ban Assault riffles or anything resembling them. The only purpose for them is to kill people. You can protect yourself with a hand gun. Bump stocks should have been banned a long time ago, no need to fire 100 rounds in a matter of seconds. Ban large magazines, have a 2 week waiting period on the national level, hire more people to investigate prospective gun purchases. No longer allow guns to purchased at gun shows and pawn stores without the proper background checks first. Restrict the amount of money allowed that politicians can except from the NRA and gun lobbyists. That's a start.

[Jason]

6 minutes ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

Ban Assault riffles or anything resembling them. The only purpose for them is to kill people. You can protect yourself with a hand gun. Bump stocks should have been banned a long time ago, no need to fire 100 rounds in a matter of seconds. Ban large magazines, have a 2 week waiting period on the national level, hire more people to investigate prospective gun purchases. No longer allow guns to purchased at gun shows and pawn stores without the proper background checks first. Restrict the amount of money allowed that politicians can except from the NRA and gun lobbyists. That's a start.

They should be doing that for more than just the gun lobby. First they'd have to define "assault weapon". Would you be OK with special permits to purchase said assault weapons? What if banning these does not stop mass shootings? What then?

[tennischmp]

18 minutes ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

Ban Assault riffles or anything resembling them. The only purpose for them is to kill people. You can protect yourself with a hand gun. Bump stocks should have been banned a long time ago, no need to fire 100 rounds in a matter of seconds. Ban large magazines, have a 2 week waiting period on the national level, hire more people to investigate prospective gun purchases. No longer allow guns to purchased at gun shows and pawn stores without the proper background checks first. Restrict the amount of money allowed that politicians can except from the NRA and gun lobbyists. That's a start.

No need to ban anything, just do what they do in Japan

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

24 minutes ago, Jason said:

They should be doing that for more than just the gun lobby. First they'd have to define "assault weapon". Would you be OK with special permits to purchase said assault weapons? What if banning these does not stop mass shootings? What then?

Let's give it a try and see. Cross that bridge when we come to it. Doing nothing sure hasn't worked.

[Jason]

25 minutes ago, tennischmp said:

No need to ban anything, just do what they do in Japan

Shotguns and air rifles? Lol, that is a lot of bans.

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

33 minutes ago, tennischmp said:

No need to ban anything, just do what they do in Japan

Name one legitimate reason to own an AR-15, any riffle that can be adapted to fire 100 rounds on full automatic or even simulate full automatic with a bump stock. The shooter in Las Vegas had a double 50 round magazine with a bump stock. That should never be allowed to happen.

Pretty sure the authors of the second amendment didn't have these types of weapons in mind, since they only had single shot flintlock muskets.

Japan

See also: Haitōrei Edict

The weapons law of Japan begins by stating "No one shall possess a firearm or firearms or a sword or swords", and very few exceptions are allowed.^[59] Citizens are permitted to possess firearms for hunting and sport shooting, but only after submitting to a lengthy licensing procedure.^[60] After ten years of shotgun ownership, a licence-holder may apply to obtain a rifle.

*************

 I would be OK with that. A lengthy licensing procedure followed by 10 years of owning only a shotgun before being allowed to own a rifle, not an assault weapon AR-15 or fact simile.

AR-15 aren't good for hunting, what they are good at, is killing from a distance. They couldn't even see the shooter in Vegas, because he was firing from concealment.