Nolan Arenado is a Dreamboat

[Troll Daddy]

As mentioned by one of our astute posters the Angels need to sign this cat. Aside from Trouty he needs to be our #1 priority for the 2020 FA class. Signing Nolan just might keep Trout in Anaheim. 

The Arenado family loves Orange County! What a boost for the Arenado Baseball ️ Club and its travel ball teams. 

Angels 2020 WS Champions !

[Dtwncbad]

I can't process this at all when you can pursue Machado this offseason and contend in 2019.

Why wait for Arenado?

[Vlad27Trout27]

No thank you, those numbers away from Colorado are not enticing for the price he'll probably ask for. The last few guys that we have brought over from a hitter friendly environment ( Hamilton and Cozart) have not worked out for us. 

[Vlad27Trout27]

Machado is probably the most over hyped free agent available and i'd rather us not go after him.  A career slash line of .282/.336/.486/.822 and including the fact he's played most of his games in Baltimore isn't worth us way overpaying for him.

[Dick B Back]

10 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

I can't process this at all when you can pursue Machado this offseason and contend in 2019.

Why wait for Arenado?

Cause Manny is a SS in his mind and I like the guy we’ve already got.

[Dtwncbad]

29 minutes ago, Vlad27Trout27 said:

Machado is probably the most over hyped free agent available and i'd rather us not go after him.  A career slash line of .282/.336/.486/.822 and including the fact he's played most of his games in Baltimore isn't worth us way overpaying for him.

I guess you can say he is "overhyped" because he hasn't put up monster numbers consistently like many free agents hitting the market at 31ish.

Maybe it would be smarter to keep an eye on him for like 4 or 5 years and make sure he can put up huge numbers in his prime and then sign him on his decline . .  .

Let someone else be dumb enough to sign up for those age 27-31 years, right?

[UndertheHalo]

Arrenado would be cool. 

Machado would be cool.

Harper would be cool. 

Grandal would be pretty cool. 

Edited August 27, 2018 by UndertheHalo

[Angel Oracle]

1 hour ago, Vlad27Trout27 said:

No thank you, those numbers away from Colorado are not enticing for the price he'll probably ask for. The last few guys that we have brought over from a hitter friendly environment ( Hamilton and Cozart) have not worked out for us. 

How is an .852 road OPS (with consistency) over the past 4 seasons not enticing?

How many MLB players have put up a higher road OPS since 2015?   

Trout and Betts don't count, because they are head and shoulders above everyone else.   Harper does have a higher road OPS since 2015 as well.

And Arenado has to play 9-10 road games a season against each of L.A., S.F., and S.D. in pitchers' parks.    That's just over 1/3 of all road games.

This ain't CarGo and his stupid terrible home/road splits that we are talking about.

Meanwhile, Machado's road OPS is .068 less (.784) than Arenado's since 2015.   And, until August he got to play about half of his road games in crazy good AL East hitters' parks. 

Imagine Arenado hitting in Houston, Tejas, and Oakland 9-10 games per season.

[Taylor]

I think a certain Troll Daddy has a mancrush on a certain Colorado third baseman.

[Angelsjunky]

Arenado is really good. Over the last four years he's 10th in the majors with a 20.3 fWAR, just ahead of Bryce Harper and just behind Manny Machado. He's essential the NL version of Machado: very good (but not great) hitter, Gold Glove third baseman.

But I don't want him. Well, I'd happily slot him into 3B, but the cost. He's probably going to get something like 8/$200MM.

I know, its not my money. But haven't we learned that lesson by now? (see: Pujols, Hamilton, Wells).

But regardless, it doesn't really matter because it isn't for another year. By then we will have a better sense of what we have in Ward, Rengifo, Fletcher, Fernandez, and even Jose Rojas as possible third basemen. I'd rather see the Angels spend league minimum on a 2-3 WAR player who has a chance to turn into a 3-5 WAR player (Ward, Rengifo, Fletcher). 

Oh yeah, if you want to know what Arenado's stats would look like translated to Anaheim in 2018, here you go:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/neutralized-stats.cgi?request=1&id=arenano01&sum=0&t=b&offset=0&to_yr=2018&to_lg=AL&to_tm=ANA&orderby=year_ID&number_matched=1&order_by_asc=1

In short, he goes from a career .293/.348/.541 hitter to .270/.323/.499. In terms of his last four years, his line would be something like .275/.340/.520. Still pretty good, but not Coors-good.

[Troll Daddy]

I know, its not my money. But haven't we learned that lesson by now? (see: Pujols, Hamilton, Wells).       

That’s your comparison  

[Angelsjunky]

I'm not comparing Arenado to those three. I'm guessing his contract would turn out much better. My point is that big contracts hamstring payrolls and team flexibility. I'd be very hesitant to hand out six-figure contracts to anyone but the true elite. Arenado is borderline. He's really good, but will probably command something like 8/$200-250MM. I'd rather see the Angels focus on keeping Trout and Ohtani around and building from within.

[Stradling]

7 hours ago, Dtwncbad said:

I guess you can say he is "overhyped" because he hasn't put up monster numbers consistently like many free agents hitting the market at 31ish.

Maybe it would be smarter to keep an eye on him for like 4 or 5 years and make sure he can put up huge numbers in his prime and then sign him on his decline . .  .

Let someone else be dumb enough to sign up for those age 27-31 years, right?

Well Machado and Arrenado are two years apart so that will mean Machado will be a free agent at 26 and Arrenado at 29.  They both play  in offensive ballparks.  Then you look at their road OPS and Arrenado in his career is 40 points higher.  My guess is Machado is going to cost about $100 million more.  I would have no problem whatsoever if they decided to wait a year and go after the less expensive, better player, that will be easier to sign considering he is a local guy.  

[tdawg87]

A left side combo of Arrenado and Simmons makes it move.

[Dtwncbad]

12 hours ago, Stradling said:

Well Machado and Arrenado are two years apart so that will mean Machado will be a free agent at 26 and Arrenado at 29.  They both play  in offensive ballparks.  Then you look at their road OPS and Arrenado in his career is 40 points higher.  My guess is Machado is going to cost about $100 million more.  I would have no problem whatsoever if they decided to wait a year and go after the less expensive, better player, that will be easier to sign considering he is a local guy.  

Let's meet half way.  Either sign Machado or trade for Arenado in the offseason and extend him so the Angels have him in 2019.

I think the majority of my opinion is how much waiting a season to solve a problem makes a me want to puke.

I am not down with any plan that in any way shrugs through 2019.

 

 

[Stradling]

9 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

Let's meet half way.  Either sign Machado or trade for Arenado in the offseason and extend him so the Angels have him in 2019.

I think the majority of my opinion is how much waiting a season to solve a problem makes a me want to puke.

I am not down with any plan that in any way shrugs through 2019.

 

 

I think trading for him is the worst possible idea based on the cost and the loss of valuable prospects.  

[Turd Ferguson]

2 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

A left side combo of Arrenado and Simmons makes it move.

[Dtwncbad]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

I think trading for him is the worst possible idea based on the cost and the loss of valuable prospects.  

So the additional year of Arenado (trade for him to have him for 2019) would be expensive in prospects, right?

Uncomfortable.

Now compare that cost to how Machado would be more expensive in money alone.

Just sign Machado, be way better in 2019 and keep the prospects.

Who knows? Maybe Arenado would want to join the Angels anyway in 2020 and play 1B.

My angle is aggressively get better now.  No waiting.  No punting 2019.  No way.

[tdawg87]

2 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

So the additional year of Arenado (trade for him to have him for 2019) would be expensive in prospects, right?

Uncomfortable.

Now compare that cost to how Machado would be more expensive in money alone.

Just sign Machado, be way better in 2019 and keep the prospects.

Who knows? Maybe Arenado would want to join the Angels anyway in 2020 and play 1B.

My angle is aggressively get better now.  No waiting.  No punting 2019.  No way.

Well why not get better in both years? Sign Keuchel and Grandal this off-season. Sign Arenado next off-season.

I'm a geenyis.

[Dtwncbad]

1 minute ago, tdawg87 said:

Well why not get better in both years? Sign Keuchel and Grandal this off-season. Sign Arenado next off-season.

I'm a geenyis.

I am fine with any plan that is not waiting to contend.  The Angels have plenty of money this offseason and there is a huge amount of free agent talent.

I am going to be one very pissed off fan if they don't aggressively go after top talent with that money.

I am a fan of talent on the field.  I am not a fan of unspent money and holes in the roster.

[Troll Daddy]

Machado is a good kid ... Buck had a lot of good things to say about him as a person. He’s going to come at a very big price tag. 

Angels have Tyler Ward slotted as 3B for now. He’s getting a extended look this season and may get a shot at 2019.  Spend money on pitching/catcher/1B. 

Arenado will be in play if Ward turns out to be a average ML player. 

[GrittyVeterans]

I get a Beltre vibe from Machado, someone that is going to be good for a long time. I think it will be a big mistake if we don’t pursue him hard 

[Stradling]

59 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

So the additional year of Arenado (trade for him to have him for 2019) would be expensive in prospects, right?

Uncomfortable.

Now compare that cost to how Machado would be more expensive in money alone.

Just sign Machado, be way better in 2019 and keep the prospects.

Who knows? Maybe Arenado would want to join the Angels anyway in 2020 and play 1B.

My angle is aggressively get better now.  No waiting.  No punting 2019.  No way.

I would use what it would take to trade for Arrenado and use that package to get DeGrom or Thor.  Then I would sign Grandall.  Then next off season go all in on Arrenado.  

[Angel Oracle]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

I think trading for him is the worst possible idea based on the cost and the loss of valuable prospects.  

This

Plus, the Halos still have other holes to solve in 2019.   Continue to build in 2019 towards perennial contention, and then sign Arenado after 2019 and preserve the probable Rondons for either playing here or use for another trade package to fill another need. 

[Dtwncbad]

1 hour ago, Troll Daddy said:

Machado is a good kid ... Buck had a lot of good things to say about him as a person. He’s going to come at a very big price tag. 

Angels have Tyler Ward slotted as 3B for now. He’s getting a extended look this season and may get a shot at 2019.  Spend money on pitching/catcher/1B. 

Arenado will be in play if Ward turns out to be a average ML player. 

For the record, do you think, or do you think the Angels think that his ceiling is actually higher than an average ML player??

I don't.  I think we would be lucky if he ended up a poor man's David Freese.