Tanking

[krAbs]

I feel like tanking in baseball is less about intentionally doing bad to get a better draft position, and more about trading current value for future value as far as players go. So, the losing is a bi-product of tanking in baseball, not the express intention.

And as far as that goes...I don't understand how you can be a serious fan of a team and NOT want them to be as smart and savvy as possible and set up a long-term franchise. If you are okay with your favorite team being meh now and meh in the future instead of bad now and great in the future, then you are an asshole.

[Hubs]

9 hours ago, Randy Gradishar said:

If the Angels had drafted higher in 2009, they might not have Trout.

It's been said that they rated him #1 on their board and Strasburg #2.

The Yankees also had him rated similarly (I think #2, with Strasburg #1).

The only reason they took Grichuck before him was as a joke to his agent, who knew the Angels would take Trout if he was there. I swear I read this somewhere.

[Jason]

Hey @Tank I assume you're the go to on this topic.

[Hubs]

1 hour ago, WeatherWonk said:

Albert is serviceable at 1st/DH. He is not a good VALUE, and he should probably be hitting no higher than 5th or 6th. He's about middle of the pack for 1st baseman. It is what it is. The contract exists. He cant be traded. At least he continues to do pretty well with RISP. 

We need to accept it and strengthen other positions around him. 3rd base, maybe RF if Kole's renaissance doesnt continue. Maybe catcher, but that is a defensive position FIRST, IMO. As much as I like Fletcher for his hustle and good D, we arent sure if he is really a .280 hitter. So maybe 2nd base, as well.

And then concentrate on PITCHING, PITCHING, PITCHING. 

I cant remember a single WS team that mashed their way to a ring without pitching. But I can remember a few that were low-medium scoring but shut down the other team's offense.

I looked it over, and I honestly can't figure out why, except players being cold, that the lineup doesn't score more runs.

Do they need another .380-.400 OBP guy leading off? Do they need another guy who hits third between Trout and Upton with better RISP? Do they need a high average guy?

To me, the only guy that fixes anything offensively in free agency is Machado, and he will have plenty of suitors. Could the Angels be involved? Sure, but it means going over the tax in future seasons. Fletcher is a good hitter, and belongs on the roster, but he's not a high OBP guy, so probably better hitting 9th. And he may not have a set position.

If they signed Machado, he'd likely hit 3rd and play 3rd, between Trout and Upton. Cozart shifts to 2nd and he or Calhoun leads off. Then in 2020, maybe Renfigo takes over leadoff and 2nd base. If you don't sign Machado, who else fits that mold? Harper, McCutchen, Jones can play RF, but Angels are committed to Calhoun through 2019.

You could take a look at Renfigo for 2nd, but he's only 21, and although he profiles as a leadoff batter, he's still playing SS, not 2nd, as he'd be doing if they thought he was going to start for them next year.

A signing of a catcher who provides some offense, is a good idea, but trading for Realmuto is not, as the cost would be too high. I'd so a similar package as what they gave up for Simmons, but what the Cardinals gave up for Osuna is too much.

 

 

 

[WeatherWonk]

Cozart is here for two more years. He will be given a starting spot on the infield next year, no doubt, unless he is injured or tanks astronomically in ST and April.

If Machado is signed, then Cozart moves to second and Fletch is our UTIL or in SLC. He would be out of the picture.

But will Machado return to third? He says he wont, I believe. You dont displace Simmons at short, no matter what. Possibly no one in the history of the game, plays a better SS than Simba.

Machado would certainly qualify as a  Big Splash that I feel we need to make us playoff competitive, through 2020, and keep Trout POSSIBLY interested in staying.

And position-player Big Splashes are a bit more reliable than pitching Big Splashes, because of the increased risk of injury to a pitcher. Spread the injury risk around throughout the acquisition of several Mini Splash pitchers.

Finding a leadoff hitter with an OBP north of .350 is also really critical, IMO. It's one of the biggest reasons we arent scoring more runs. That should be another Mini Splash on the list.

[Tank]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

Hey @Tank I assume you're the go to on this topic.

Yessir! Whaddaya need?

[krAbs]

6 minutes ago, Hubs said:

I looked it over, and I honestly can't figure out why, except players being cold, that the lineup doesn't score more runs.

Do they need another .380-.400 OBP guy leading off? Do they need another guy who hits third between Trout and Upton with better RISP? Do they need a high average guy?

To me, the only guy that fixes anything offensively in free agency is Machado, and he will have plenty of suitors. Could the Angels be involved? Sure, but it means going over the tax in future seasons. Fletcher is a good hitter, and belongs on the roster, but he's not a high OBP guy, so probably better hitting 9th. And he may not have a set position.

If they signed Machado, he'd likely hit 3rd and play 3rd, between Trout and Upton. Cozart shifts to 2nd and he or Calhoun leads off. Then in 2020, maybe Renfigo takes over leadoff and 2nd base. If you don't sign Machado, who else fits that mold? Harper, McCutchen, Jones can play RF, but Angels are committed to Calhoun through 2019.

You could take a look at Renfigo for 2nd, but he's only 21, and although he profiles as a leadoff batter, he's still playing SS, not 2nd, as he'd be doing if they thought he was going to start for them next year.

A signing of a catcher who provides some offense, is a good idea, but trading for Realmuto is not, as the cost would be too high. I'd so a similar package as what they gave up for Simmons, but what the Cardinals gave up for Osuna is too much.

 

 

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/team_compare.cgi

I really like this as a resource because it breaks out the good and bad of the team vs everyone else. IMO, the most obvious flaw with the team has been pitching - especially starting. if we were perfectly average there, we would likely be contending. Looking at just offence:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/team_compare.cgi?request=1&year=2018&lg=MLB&stat=WAR_off

As for hitting...it looks like the combination of Pujols at first, Cozart/Valbuena at third (Cozart put up a positive oWAR, but it was a small number and not nearly enough to offset the damage done by Vabluena's -0.8 oWAR this year), and Calhoun at RF have really killed us. Pujols gonna be Pujols - he is going to drag the team down one way or another, and there isn't much we can do about it. Ideally moving forward into next year, we will find a solution at third, and Calhoun will continue to mash (and not go back to being a literal sack of shit at the plate). Pujols will continue to hurt us, but hey...

Also, its worth noting that we are technically better than the average team at producing runs - even with those three garbage positions (14/30 teams, 498 runs where the MLB average is 486 and the AL average is 490).

[Lou]

2 minutes ago, Randy Gradishar said:

I mean would they really have taken Trout #1 Orval Overall, though? 

I don't think any team would have passed on Strasburg at no. 1

[Lou]

6 hours ago, Hubs said:

The only reason they took Grichuck before him was as a joke to his agent, who knew the Angels would take Trout if he was there. I swear I read this somewhere.

I don't recall ever reading this 

[tdawg87]

31 minutes ago, Lou said:

I don't recall ever reading this 

I do.

[Lou]

Just now, tdawg87 said:

I do.

Link?

(Of you reading the article)

[tdawg87]

[stormngt]

On 8/3/2018 at 9:46 AM, Hubs said:

It's been said that they rated him #1 on their board and Strasburg #2.

The Yankees also had him rated similarly (I think #2, with Strasburg #1).

The only reason they took Grichuck before him was as a joke to his agent, who knew the Angels would take Trout if he was there. I swear I read this somewhere.

That's what's been reported

[stormngt]

19 hours ago, Lou said:

I don't recall ever reading this 

They had back to back picks.  It was well reported that the Angel's top pick was Yrout.  Since they had the immediate pick after they picked Grichulk first in order to have a lower slot money for Trout....or something like that

[Lou]

34 minutes ago, stormngt said:

They had back to back picks.  It was well reported that the Angel's top pick was Yrout.  Since they had the immediate pick after they picked Grichulk first in order to have a lower slot money for Trout....or something like that

that's a different matter than the one we were discussing 

[Revad]

If Machado is open to playing 3b I think he’s on the board as an option regardless of luxury tax considerations.  I’ll be very surprised if there isn’t a big acquisition signing next year but I suspect it will be the bullpen.  I also see a trade for an impact player as a very high probability,, and likely both a big signing and a big trade.  

Making a big push would be so respectful of Pujols and Trout, and would fit what I understand as Artes brand for the Angels.

[Revad]

On 8/3/2018 at 3:20 AM, Troll Daddy said:

Tanking isn’t in the Angels vocabulary  ... especially if you intend on resigning Mike Trout. 

Troll- as I understand it I’d be throwing a ball at the red circle but generally its best if Im looking where I’m throwing.  But I could get past that because I can see the woman in the spot, unfortunately I can’t stop looking for the spot in the woman.  The outcome would be me trying to guide the throw to the spot, it slips out of my hand goes way high and rolls into the tree.  The ball cannot he found but I successfully dunk the woman by banging my head against the spot on the right.

And after banging my head against the target I come here to Angels Win and bang my head against posters.  It’s all good.