Tanking

[kevinb]

Not an asshole. But I am in the camp of I’d rather be in last place and get a better draft pick for the future than finish 15th or so and have no shot at the playoffs. Both teams aren’t making the playoffs. I’d rather have a higher chance of getting a higher quality draft pick. 

[kevinb]

48 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

There's no sense in playing poorly to move up a few draft spots when you are clearly going to try and compete again next year.  

Grabbing some momentum by seeing the kids play well for the rest of this year would be great.  

Momentum isn’t real. Play the kids and see what they have going forward. But there’s no way momentum lasts from season to season. I barely believe in momentum from game to game. 

[stormngt]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

If you are ok with your favorite team losing on purpose, then you are an asshole.  Discuss.  

Giving your kids some at bats is a good idea.  However whoever plays have to play to win.  Never an excuse for tanking.

[stormngt]

1 hour ago, UndertheHalo said:

Well, I guess technically when the alternatives are Marte or Valbuena that is true.  It’s not exactly going for it either though. 

I’d like to see Thaiss, Rengifo, and Ward all get 50+ AB’s this.  Not because I care if they win games or not, just because I’m interested in what we have in those players.  Hopefully this happens sooner then later. 

Dfa valbueno and bring up Fernandez.  No reason for him to stay down in AAA.

Either give him at bats to make a determination if he could bat on Mlb level.  Then trade him if Thais is ready.

[stormngt]

4 hours ago, Kevinb said:

Momentum isn’t real. Play the kids and see what they have going forward. But there’s no way momentum lasts from season to season. I barely believe in momentum from game to game. 

Agreed that momentum isnt season to season

Disagree about game to game.

[stormngt]

1 minute ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

MLB draft is a crapshoot. No use tanking.

Focus on preparing for next year. If there are players on the roster like Valbuena and Marte who have no chance of making the team next April, they shouldn't be on the team now.

Plus they need to know if they got any Inexpensive replacement on the farm.  The more we can replace internally the better.

[m0nkey]

I am waiting for @Tank's appearance in this thread so he can teach us his ways.

[Angel Oracle]

Isn’t it better for 2019 to see what the youngsters can do, then to continue to play a poor offense and defense veteran like Valnobuena?

We’ve already gone 29 games into the second half.   What purpose is served in continuing to play Valnobuena?

[Tank]

4 hours ago, mulwin444 said:

Are you just trying to turn @Tank into a verb?

My wife says this is easily done and very worthwhile.

[Tank]

58 minutes ago, m0nkey said:

I am waiting for @Tank's appearance in this thread so he can teach us his ways.

Sorry but some things you're not old enough to hear about, let alone know.

for example, I'm never going to tell you about the Venus Butterfly.

[eligrba]

And another wasted year for Mike Trout.

[Waybackman]

Meanwhile in Boston, Kinsler is having a good time. He’s 3 for 5 with a few rbis and his average is up to about .240. Must be nice to be sent to a contender.

[fan_since79]

I don't think we're going to lose on purpose. We're just going to lose even though we're trying to win.

We're just a really bad team right now, and going into the tank is a definite possibility here.

 

[WeatherWonk]

27 minutes ago, fan_since79 said:

I don't think we're going to lose on purpose. We're just going to lose even though we're trying to win.

We're just a really bad team right now, and going into the tank is a definite possibility here.

 

Yeah, really. If this team actually tried to tank, would we be able to tell the difference in their play?

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, Angel Oracle said:

Isn’t it better for 2019 to see what the youngsters can do, then to continue to play a poor offense and defense veteran like Valnobuena?

We’ve already gone 29 games into the second half.   What purpose is served in continuing to play Valnobuena?

Yes it is.  I have no idea why he is still playing, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him released.  I would bet money on him being gone before the end of the season.  They must really be against bringing up Ward.  I wonder if it has something to do with the 40 man roster at this point.  Or he just isn’t ready defensively.  

[tennischmp]

5 hours ago, Stradling said:

That’s not losing on purpose.  

So what is losing on purpose then? That's definitely not playing to make the playoffs. 

TBH this is a silly thread, no team is going to lose on purpose. They will lose because they are not good enough. 

And there is nothing wrong with hoping your favorite team continues to lose either for the purpose of getting a better pick or for the hope of major changes happening next year. 

[UndertheHalo]

3 hours ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

MLB draft is a crapshoot. No use tanking.

Focus on preparing for next year. If there are players on the roster like Valbuena and Marte who have no chance of making the team next April, they shouldn't be on the team now.

It’s thinking like this that makes fans completely not understand why their team sucks.  There’s a very common thread among teams that win.  It’s not spending big in FA.  Doing well in the draft is what good organizations do.  Some are much better at it then others.  It’s easier with a higher draft pick.  The draft is massively important.  Probably the most important thing.  

Edited August 3, 2018 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

4 minutes ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

In 2000, the Phillies selected Chase Utley with the 15th overall pick.

Pujols was drafted in the 13th round, Trumbo in the 18th round, Piazza in the 60th round . . .

Only two first overall picks ended up in the hall of fame. That doesn't bode well for Justin Upton, a first overall pick himself.

Obviously, good scouting and organizational philosophy is very important. 

Ya there’s good players all over the draft.  Which is why teams that are good at it are the best.  The Angels kept signing FA and losing draft picks.  Compounded by drafting shitty. So we’ve been paying for that.  

[eaterfan]

As mentioned in the other thread about the draft. It's really not fair to compare the draft now to the draft under previous CBAs. The slot pool allocations decline at a rate far faster than the talent level. So moving up in the draft carries a bigger advantage than it has in the past. Will one or two spots make a big difference? Unlikely, but 10 spots is a pretty big difference. The draft isn't an exact science but scouting is pretty good. The earlier you are picked the more likely you are to be a good pro, but getting extra slot money allows a team to take more chances.

[Troll Daddy]

Tanking isn’t in the Angels vocabulary  ... especially if you intend on resigning Mike Trout. 

[Taylor]

5 hours ago, Waybackman said:

Meanwhile in Boston, Kinsler is having a good time. He’s 3 for 5 with a few rbis and his average is up to about .240. Must be nice to be sent to a contender.

In before someone is outraged that we traded Kinsler.

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

9 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

Hey ! I think this winter is going to exciting.  I’m very much looking forward to it.  Let’s get this dumpster fire season over with ASAP and get on with the hot stove season !  I think the Angels will be active and I think come January we’re all going to be irrationally optimistic again.  Good times !

october will suck tho.  Hopefully we don’t have to deal with the Doyers in the World Series again. 

There maybe 5 or 6 days in the entire offseason that may or may not make me happy. All the rest are meh.

[TroutAdell]

16 hours ago, Chuckster70 said:

Until the Angels dump Valbuena, Marte and some of these other veteran reserve guys and bring up our prospects I have no interest in watching to be honest. Especially when Trout & Ohtani are not in the lineup. 

Ohtani should be starting against lefties too. Let him get as many looks against southpaws this year in a down season as possible so that he can make the necessary adjustments against them heading into next year. 

Just remember that when Ohtani starts at DH Albert starts at first base. Albert can’t play in the field everyday. 

[WeatherWonk]

1 hour ago, TroutTrumbo said:

Just remember that when Ohtani starts at DH Albert starts at first base. Albert can’t play in the field everyday. 

Albert is serviceable at 1st/DH. He is not a good VALUE, and he should probably be hitting no higher than 5th or 6th. He's about middle of the pack for 1st baseman. It is what it is. The contract exists. He cant be traded. At least he continues to do pretty well with RISP. 

We need to accept it and strengthen other positions around him. 3rd base, maybe RF if Kole's renaissance doesnt continue. Maybe catcher, but that is a defensive position FIRST, IMO. As much as I like Fletcher for his hustle and good D, we arent sure if he is really a .280 hitter. So maybe 2nd base, as well.

And then concentrate on PITCHING, PITCHING, PITCHING. 

I cant remember a single WS team that mashed their way to a ring without pitching. But I can remember a few that were low-medium scoring but shut down the other team's offense.

[floplag]

I can never support any team tanking intentionally, fan or not, it hurts the credibility of the game on every level.  You have 2 teams fighting for a playoff spot one gets a tough opponent one gets a team vying for draft spots, the wrong team makes the playoffs... that should never happen.