Dipoto or Eppler, who would you rather have?

[cez]

3 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Cez, he’s doing the same thing to you guys that he did to us.  Jerry Dipoto can wheel and deal, I’ll give him that.  Sometimes he gets the major league deals right.  Sometimes he doesn’t.  What seems clear to me is that he doesn’t have a great deal of respect for the development aspect of running a major league organization.   It’s why he drafted low risk, low ceiling college players primarily for us.  With us he surrounded himself with guys that are frankly, fuc*k ups.  As I understand it, the Mariners didn’t have much of a farm system to speak of before he took over.  Now, they are arguably the worst.  You guys don’t have a Mike Trout.  You guys don’t have the financial resources that the Angels have. Cano and Cruz are old.  King Felix is old.  Paxton is great but the rest of the pitchers suck.  The Mariners are pretty good for now, but Dipoto’s game is not viable over the long term. And once it goes south, you guys are in for a lot of losing with very little good on the horizon. 

all true, but you missed the point

you'll figure it out sooner than it took me, i hope

[Vegas Halo Fan]

A lot of what Eppler has done hasn't shown up on the field yet, because unlike his counterpart in Seattle, he set out to rebuild what was a dreadful farm system when he got here. He also inherited a major league roster with too many players being paid major money for not producing.

[UndertheHalo]

Just now, GOPSnowflakesHateCezero said:

all true, but you missed the point

you'll figure it out sooner than it took me, i hope

The worst thing that Arte did was back the Angels out of the international acquisition market.  Peter Angelos is doing the same thing.  Before this new system, it was all bullshit but Arte was wrong to not play the game and it hurt the Angels. 

I think that your allusion to Arte being behind all the Angels problems is a bit overstated tho.  The Angels have had some very good years under Arte Moreno.  He’s not perfect, he deserves his share of the blame, but it’s not all his.  Sometimes you put people in charge and they’re incompetent.  At least they seem to be on the right track now.  And that’s to Arte’s credit.

[UndertheHalo]

3 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

A lot of what Eppler has done hasn't shown up on the field yet, because unlike his counterpart in Seattle, he set out to rebuild what was a dreadful farm system when he got here. He also inherited a major league roster with too many players being paid major money for not producing.

Eppler, to be fair has also been imperfect.  He’s missed pretty badly on some guys, but hey trying to put the Angels back together was and is a very tall order.  We’re close.  Even if at times it feels like we’re not.  and this season still has a lot of baseball left.  

Tough, tough series though.

[DEVLBAT]

Eppler is building this team to be a contender for years, not one season.  It’s frustrating as hell, but we will all be thanking him in the long run.

[Angel Oracle]

I think what Cez might be saying is that while Dip*ssy isn’t too keen on farm system building and is arrogant, the other factor in this mediocre decade for the Halos is that Arte Moreno was running this franchise like he ran one of his billboard companies.  He didn’t seem to care about the traditional baseball nuances as much as big splashes like Wells, Pujols, and Hackilton to attract attention.

Has Arte Moreno finally learned his lesson?   Time will tell.   It has been going on 6 years since Hackilton was signed, and only Upton’s big salary has been acquired since then, and even that seemingly has a bit of strategy not related simply to drawing 3 million fans.

It was very weak of him to totally turn his back on Latin America, just because the practices to acquire players was a little shady.   At least that isn’t an issue anymore.

And who gives a manager a TEN year contract?????  No one had EVER done that, and no one has since then.

[Stradling]

My understanding is Arte didn’t turn his back on Latin America as much as our guys there acted in such an unethical that he pulled out.  Then had to let the dust clear so to speak.  

As for has he finally learned his lesson, well it certainly seems like he learned his lesson 6 long years ago.  Not sure why we would have to ask that question if it’s been 6 years.

 

[nando714]

9 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

I saw one dude say that and he was probably joking.

This is stupid. Your burgers are stupid. Shut up.

Fatburger >

[nando714]

6 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

Cez, he’s doing the same thing to you guys that he did to us.  Jerry Dipoto can wheel and deal, I’ll give him that.  Sometimes he gets the major league deals right.  Sometimes he doesn’t.  What seems clear to me is that he doesn’t have a great deal of respect for the development aspect of running a major league organization.   It’s why he drafted low risk, low ceiling college players primarily for us.  With us he surrounded himself with guys that are frankly, fuc*k ups.  As I understand it, the Mariners didn’t have much of a farm system to speak of before he took over.  Now, they are arguably the worst.  You guys don’t have a Mike Trout.  You guys don’t have the financial resources that the Angels have. Cano and Cruz are old.  King Felix is old.  Paxton is great but the rest of the pitchers suck.  The Mariners are pretty good for now, but Dipoto’s game is not viable over the long term. And once it goes south, you guys are in for a lot of losing with very little good on the horizon. 

Yet

44-24

We are hoping Seattle goes south so we don’t look like morons. 

Fact is. It’s a club that has it going. Those are hard to stop 

[eligrba]

With a few exceptions,  this is Eppler's team and they suck. However I am not ready to completely blame him because of the constraints he inherited.  Bottom line,  this team is awful and it probably won't change this year. 

[zenmaster]

JeDi is having his 2014 Angels season. They will win a lot of games and do nothing in the post season. I'd rather have Eppler who has a long term plan. JeDi has a short term plan and if they don't cash it, it's crisis mode. 

[Stradling]

40 minutes ago, eligrba said:

With a few exceptions,  this is Eppler's team and they suck. However I am not ready to completely blame him because of the constraints he inherited.  Bottom line,  this team is awful and it probably won't change this year. 

I think your defenition of awful is hilarious.  

[nando714]

45 minutes ago, zenmaster said:

JeDi is having his 2014 Angels season. They will win a lot of games and do nothing in the post season. I'd rather have Eppler who has a long term plan. JeDi has a short term plan and if they don't cash it, it's crisis mode. 

Eppler has a long term plan?

if we are rebuilding then go full cubs and Astros. Don’t spend 100+ million on upton, but now you’re stuck with Mike Trout and you have show him we’re “competing” when we’re really not 

Don’t pretend to be contenders , just go full rebuild 

and you can’t rebuild with the same manager who been here since 2000. Jmo

[zenmaster]

1 minute ago, nando714 said:

Eppler has a long term plan?

if we are rebuilding then go full cubs and Astros. Don’t spend 100+ million on upton, but now you’re stuck with Mike Trout and you have show him we’re “competing” when we’re really not 

Don’t pretend to be contenders , just go full rebuild 

and you can’t rebuild with the same manager who been here since 2000. Jmo

Our farm system is looking better than it has in a long time and the Mariners is probably worse than it has been in a long time. That's all I meant. 

[Lou]

25 minutes ago, nando714 said:

but now you’re stuck with Mike Trout

the horror!

[Angel Oracle]

Scioscia should no longer be here after 2018.

A fresh group of young players over the next 2-3 years needs a more modern approach manager.

Plus Scioscia’s way is stale after 19 seasons.   This likely explains why only a handful of managers in MLB history have lasted longer with one team.

[Dick Enberg]

Eppler is looking like he missed on a few free agent signings, but he obviously has a balanced plan for the team. DipoTOE has thrown his whole career into this team. if they don't go deep into the play-offs, he's toast. might have a little window next year, but his rotation is not going to cut it. no ifs, ands, or's about it. Paxton, washed up Felix, and the 3 guys that beat us. we scored on them, but they just scored more because our bullpen stinks and wuss Richards is hurt again. 

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, nando714 said:

Yet

44-24

We are hoping Seattle goes south so we don’t look like morons. 

Fact is. It’s a club that has it going. Those are hard to stop 

Someone is talking but not casting a vote for Dipoto....     Why is that?

[Inside Pitch]

4 hours ago, The Boogie Man said:

My understanding is Arte didn’t turn his back on Latin America as much as our guys there acted in such an unethical that he pulled out.  Then had to let the dust clear so to speak.  

As for has he finally learned his lesson, well it certainly seems like he learned his lesson 6 long years ago.  Not sure why we would have to ask that question if it’s been 6 years.

They got caught ripping off kids and lost the faith of everyone on the Island...    The handlers and everyone else just wanted no part of the Angels because they felt they were dirty and couldn't be trusted.  The carryover from the Daniels fiasco was pretty ugly.

[Inside Pitch]

45 minutes ago, nando714 said:

Eppler has a long term plan?

if we are rebuilding then go full cubs and Astros. Don’t spend 100+ million on upton, but now you’re stuck with Mike Trout and you have show him we’re “competing” when we’re really not 

Don’t pretend to be contenders , just go full rebuild 

and you can’t rebuild with the same manager who been here since 2000. Jmo

More talking -- but still no vote.   Meow....

It's hilarious that you talk about them going Cubs and Astros -- you're the same guy that said he couldn't get into the Angels when you were a kid because why bother (they were bad).   You couldn't handle a full rebuild..    I mean, you are having a meltdown in June.

 

 

[Dick B Back]

The easiest vote I’ve ever submitted on AW.

[nando714]

19 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

More talking -- but still no vote.   Meow....

It's hilarious that you talk about them going Cubs and Astros -- you're the same guy that said he couldn't get into the Angels when you were a kid because why bother (they were bad).   You couldn't handle a full rebuild..    I mean, you are having a meltdown in June.

 

 

Ok, now you’re misquoting me 

I said I didn’t really care if they were successful or not when I was a kid. 

if they went full rebuild then that is more understandable on why they’re not winning. There is a clear cut plan. 

There is no clear cut plan right now with this franchise. It’s stuck in neutral.  That’s what is frustrating  and now mike trout stuck in the middle. 

Time is ticking on him. IMO the FO has to put out feelers to his camp if he has any interest in extending his stay here and if not we need to get a nice haul for him in the future. We can’t just let him walk and end up with a draft pick, if he does decide to move on from Los Angeles (unless he signs with the dodgers).

just look at Baltimore. Why the hell is machado still there? He should have been traded a month ago. 

[Angel Oracle]

35 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

They got caught ripping off kids and lost the faith of everyone on the Island...    The handlers and everyone else just wanted no part of the Angels because they felt they were dirty and couldn't be trusted.  The carryover from the Daniels fiasco was pretty ugly.

Daniels can go eat a toadstool, and I wouldn't object.   What a sleazebag.

Eppler’s farm plan is working.   The issue is with how he approached the relievers issue in the off-season.  If he had done what he did the previous off-season, the Halos might only be 2-3 games behind the M’s.   Trading for a nearly washed up Johnson is not my idea of acquiring necessary relief help, although it brought in needed int’l money to sign Ohtani.

[UndertheHalo]

2 hours ago, eligrba said:

With a few exceptions,  this is Eppler's team and they suck. However I am not ready to completely blame him because of the constraints he inherited.  Bottom line,  this team is awful and it probably won't change this year. 

Lol.  This is ridiculous. 

[Inside Pitch]

8 minutes ago, nando714 said:

Ok, now you’re misquoting me 

I said I didn’t really care if they were successful or not when I was a kid. 

Wasn't trying to misquote you.  Sorry if I misunderstood what you wrote

11 minutes ago, nando714 said:

if they went full rebuild then that is more understandable on why they’re not winning. There is a clear cut plan. 

There is no clear cut plan right now with this franchise. It’s stuck in neutral.  That’s what is frustrating  and now mike trout stuck in the middle. 

LOL..   

The Cubs plan took 7 years, and five 87+ loss seasons to get them back to the postseason.  The Astros plan took 10 years and seven 86+ loss seasons to get there.    Please enlighten me -- why is that a better plan than what Eppler is doing?  Does being a bigger loser for longer make you a better winner?  Beyond that -- the Cubs and Astros model can't really be replicated anymore, the draft and international game has been completely redone IMO as much to deter teams from doing the full tank job as it was to create better balance.   

The fact is you're ignorant of the plan and not a case of there not being one.  Right now it's looking like the team is well of ahead of where ANYONE could have hoped for at this point -- they have gotten incredibly lucky with some picks, seen some guys rise that NOBODY saw coming and have restored organizational depth at the lower levels.   David Fletcher and Luis Rengifo alone have made for a rapid organizational improvement and neither one of them is really thought of as one of our best prospects.  

You're looking at the MLB team and doing your usual kneejerk reaction then applying it to the franchise as a whole..  there is nothing new in your take.   But the situation is a lot better off than they were last year and that would be true even if they had a worse record than last years (they don't).  As hard as it for some to believe the window is opening, not closing... 

33 minutes ago, nando714 said:

Time is ticking on him. IMO the FO has to put out feelers to his camp if he has any interest in extending his stay here and if not we need to get a nice haul for him in the future. We can’t just let him walk and end up with a draft pick, if he does decide to move on from Los Angeles (unless he signs with the dodgers).

just look at Baltimore. Why the hell is machado still there? He should have been traded a month ago. 

What is it you care more about -- the team building a winner with Mike Trout or the team not looking stupid?   I have no clue what Trout is thinking, nobody here does.  But Im willing to bet he is more clued in to where this team is going than anyone on this board.

Gutting the long term health of the franchise to try "pretend" they are trying is easily the worst thing this team could do.  The "non plan" is coming together..   Trust the process.