The Official 2017-2018 Hot Stove Thread

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, OHTANILAND said:

Imagine that.....sorry honey, I was trying to get $150M but I had to settle for $110M so we’re just going have to change our lifestyle. 

But guys like you want these guys to take far less than that.  You want your ownership to make three year offers.  Then when they don’t accept that offer you’ll bitch about the quality of the product on the field.  

[VariousCrap]

3 hours ago, Stradling said:

But guys like you want these guys to take far less than that.  You want your ownership to make three year offers.  Then when they don’t accept that offer you’ll bitch about the quality of the product on the field.  

 

For the record, I'm saying none of the remaining guys out there now are worth more than three years.  That will change next off-season when you have a bunch of elite free agents.  For example, I'd give Harper a 7 year contract in a heartbeat if I was a GM.

[VariousCrap]

5 hours ago, Troll Daddy said:

Good luck with that thought 

 

I'm just saying with those left on the market now.  Anyone who gives Martinez, Darvish or Arietta more than three years will regret it for sure.

[Stradling]

8 minutes ago, VariousCrap said:

 

For the record, I'm saying none of the remaining guys out there now are worth more than three years.  That will change next off-season when you have a bunch of elite free agents.  For example, I'd give Harper a 7 year contract in a heartbeat if I was a GM.

And he will get 10-12 years. 

[VariousCrap]

32 minutes ago, Stradling said:

And he will get 10-12 years. 

 

I bet he doesn't.

[bloodbrother]

Harper probably will angle for a 10 yr deal with an opt out after like yr4-5 so he can set himself up for potentially another even better contract at age 30

[Troll Daddy]

Darvish is annoying ... pick a team ! 

[beatlesrule]

I am okay with the lack of signings.  These long term 100 million plus deals rarely ever work out.  Owners are finally wising up.  Plus, the Angels have made some good moves so I can't really complain.

[Homebrewer]

Danny Espinosa agrees to minor league deal with Yankees.

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/22299171/danny-espinosa-agrees-minor-league-deal-new-york-yankees

 

[Blarg]

On 1/30/2018 at 1:03 PM, Inside Pitch said:

And owners are getting 50 mil from the sale of BAM....   

There is nothing that says any of these teams are required or compelled to spend to the cap. 

So it's disingenuous to say they are colluding when many of these teams have what they consider their operating ceiling and will not spend past that regardless of needs. 

We have an owner that runs payroll to the MLB cap. And yet some dolts call him cheap because he won't cross that line. I'm surprised the Angels have walked that fine line for so long. 

So how does the players union justify their claims when so many teams are running near the payroll cap? 

Edited February 3, 2018 by Blarg

[Stradling]

I see both sides of it.  When teams are purposely losing and not reinvesting money they get from revenue sharing its total bullshit.  I’m not sure it should be the players bitching but rather the owners that pay in.  The extra playoff teams should push teams to spend a little bit to compete.  As far as being surprised Arte spends as much every year on payroll, why, the team is 6th in total revenue in the league.  He should put that money into payroll.  Any team that gets $150 million in local tv should be expected to be towards the top in payroll.  

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

I see both sides of it.  When teams are purposely losing and not reinvesting money they get from revenue sharing its total bullshit.  I’m not sure it should be the players bitching but rather the owners that pay in.  The extra playoff teams should push teams to spend a little bit to compete.  As far as being surprised Arte spends as much every year on payroll, why, the team is 6th in total revenue in the league.  He should put that money into payroll.  Any team that gets $150 million in local tv should be expected to be towards the top in payroll.  

there's probably a pretty clear cut ROI on spending.  Coming off 98 wins in 2014 set the ball in motion.  Payroll was largely set in 2012/13 for the subsequent 4-5 years.  Pitching health in 2016 and 2017 likely makes the halos a much different team.  Fingers crossed for 18 as the starting staff has the largest potential variance of any segment of this team.  Full seasons from Ohtani, Richards, Skaggs, Heaney and Shoe/Trop/Bridwell gives us one of the better staffs in the AL.  Point being, payroll has been justified 

[Inside Pitch]

4 hours ago, Blarg said:

There is nothing that says any of these teams are required or compelled to spend to the cap. 

So it's disingenuous to say they are colluding when many of these teams have what they consider their operating ceiling and will not spend past that regardless of needs. 

We have an owner that runs payroll to the MLB cap. And yet some dolts call him cheap because he won't cross that line. I'm surprised the Angels have walked that fine line for so long. 

So how does the players union justify their claims when so many teams are running near the payroll cap? 

FWIW -- I offered no opinion on whether or not they should spend -- I responded to a post talking about the kind of money available in the game by pointing to the additional 50 mil teams have been given to play with this year. .. Nothing more.   

Personally my view is that the players may have painted themselves into a corner. 

 1- They have been driving down the earning potential of players coming into the league for years (to get more themselves), and have recently agreed to a new CBA that did little to slow that....  The end result is that teams can now legitimately argue it makes no sense being penalized in the draft by having their resources and ability to spend there TAKEN AWAY.   

2 - There has been no report of them making any sort of effort to include language into the CBA that would keep teams from selling off and tanking and yet they willfully accepted the tax parameters as is, including the penalties for going over ... but setting no limits as to how much a team can benefit from gaming the system or purposely tanking. 

3 - They seemingly failed to see how teams becoming better at the usage of analytics may have made it easier for them to avoid potential land-mines.  It was super cool when agents showed up at the bargaining table with a dossier on how their player was great and favorably compared to Willie Mays but now that info works both ways...  The union has been caught flat footed IMO.   

4 - The "Boras effect", also helps temper collusion argument IMO .... For years the top end guys set the bar for the rest..  For years he's held his players back and waited for offers..   This year it seems to have bit the players in the ass.   

Do I believe something might be going on?  Maybe..   Do I believe the players have any real argument -- No.   We can however safely say the players are beginning to dig their heels in a bit and the rhetoric is starting .... I fully believe the MLBPA will do everything that can to try to invent one.

[Redondo]

Agent: 'Fight is brewing' over slow MLB market

Agent Brodie Van Wagenen of Creative Artists Agency stopped short of using the word "collusion" but said the behavior of owners "feels coordinated, rightly or wrongly."

"There is a rising tide among players for radical change," Van Wagenen said in a Twitter post Friday. "A fight is brewing. And it may begin with one, maybe two, and perhaps 1,200 willing to follow. A boycott of spring training may be a starting point, if behavior doesn't change.

"Bottom line, the players are upset. No, they are outraged. Players in the midst of long-term contracts are as frustrated as those still seeking employment. Their voices are getting louder and they are uniting in a way not seen since 1994."

[Homebrewer]

^^^

Someone with a personal stake trying to foment trouble. Good luck trying to sell that one to the general public (the fans).

[Troll Daddy]

Colón traded to the Expos for Cliff Lee, Grady Sizemore, and Brandon Phillips.

 

 

 

[Ohtaniland]

18 hours ago, Redondo said:

Agent: 'Fight is brewing' over slow MLB market

Agent Brodie Van Wagenen of Creative Artists Agency stopped short of using the word "collusion" but said the behavior of owners "feels coordinated, rightly or wrongly."

"There is a rising tide among players for radical change," Van Wagenen said in a Twitter post Friday. "A fight is brewing. And it may begin with one, maybe two, and perhaps 1,200 willing to follow. A boycott of spring training may be a starting point, if behavior doesn't change.

"Bottom line, the players are upset. No, they are outraged. Players in the midst of long-term contracts are as frustrated as those still seeking employment. Their voices are getting louder and they are uniting in a way not seen since 1994."

So a few players are missing the cruise ship because they wanted nicer suites and didn’t get them. Boo hoo 

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20180213T00&p0=853&msg=Countdown+to+Pitchers+and+Catchers+report+to+Spring+Training&font=cursive

[Tank]

On 2/3/2018 at 10:35 AM, Troll Daddy said:

Colón traded to the Expos for Cliff Lee, Grady Sizemore, and Brandon Phillips.

and then he went and signed a minnor league deal with the rangers yesterday.

i hope he's one ex-angel that really sucks against us.

 

Edited February 5, 2018 by Tank

[SoWhat]

Man, I wish the Angels would try to trade for Realmuto. As much as I love Maldonado, he shouldn't be starting, he's pretty much an automatic out.

With the OF set for the next 3+ years, I'd be okay with Jam Jones headlining a package for Realmuto. 

[Angelsfan1984]

6 minutes ago, SoWhat said:

Man, I wish the Angels would try to trade for Realmuto. As much as I love Maldonado, he shouldn't be starting, he's pretty much an automatic out.

With the OF set for the next 3+ years, I'd be okay with Jam Jones headlining a package for Realmuto. 

He's fine with the bat and he wore down. Hence why we need a capable backup catcher to give Maldy a day off. Obviously his real value is in his glove, you know the golden one?

[SoWhat]

4 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

He's fine with the bat and he wore down. Hence why we need a capable backup catcher to give Maldy a day off. Obviously his real value is in his glove, you know the golden one?

Lol

His highest OPS in a month was .764, which was in May, every other month his OPS was in the .600's he was consistently terrible at the plate, so please tell me where he slowed down 

Like I said, I like Maldonado, I just don't think he should be starting due to his anemic bat.

 

[Angel Oracle]

5 minutes ago, SoWhat said:

Lol

His highest OPS in a month was .764, which was in May, every other month his OPS was in the .600's he was consistently terrible at the plate, so please tell me where he slowed down 

Like I said, I like Maldonado, I just don't think he should be starting due to his anemic bat.

 

Pre-ASB = .725 OPS, post-ASB = .539 OPS = sounds like wearing down was the main issue, to me anyway.

How many GG catchers put up a .725 OPS for an entire season, aside from the Pudge's and Bench's?  Even Bengie's was in the .600s in 2002.

[VariousCrap]

On 2/3/2018 at 11:34 PM, OHTANILAND said:

So a few players are missing the cruise ship because they wanted nicer suites and didn’t get them. Boo hoo 

Make no mistake about it, the players and agents attitudes have everything to do with entitlement.  When JD Martinez says he wants a 7/200 million dollar contract, gets offered a 5/100 million dollar contract and says no to that contract because it is not enough, that is entitlement.

[Angelsfan1984]

3 minutes ago, SoWhat said:

Lol

His highest OPS in a month was .764, which was in May, every other month his OPS was in the .600's he was consistently terrible at the plate, so please tell me where he slowed down 

Like I said, I like Maldonado, I just don't think he should be starting due to his anemic bat.

 

I'd take his "anemic" bat if that means we get him behind the plate. His value was and always will be his glove.