The Official 2017-2018 Hot Stove Thread

[VariousCrap]

7 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

What do you guys think about Ellsbury. If the yanks are really willing to pay at least half of the remaining contract we could move Calhoun and get our leadoff hitter for a decently cheap price.

 

No.  No team should help the Yankees with the Ellsbury contract.

[Stradling]

26 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

What do you guys think about Ellsbury. If the yanks are really willing to pay at least half of the remaining contract we could move Calhoun and get our leadoff hitter for a decently cheap price.

He’s owed $64 million over 3 years plus I think a $5 million buy out of the following year, but I could be mistaken.  Regardless, if the Yankees pay half, you’re replacing a good player with a worse player and your paying him more.  So outside of acquiring a really nice piece for Kole I certainly wouldn’t entertain this. 

[totdprods]

White Sox DFAed OF Jacob May to make room for Miguel Gonzales.....May could be a decent cheap 4th OF option. Switch-hitter, 26, speedy. Not much else.

[Angel Dog and Beer]

I didn't realize that other than his monster 2011 season (321/376/552,146 OPS+, 2nd in MVP voting), he's been rather pedestrian. Only 4 of his 11 season has he had an OPS+ >100. Granted he's been hurt a lot too. 

[Angelsfan1984]

33 minutes ago, Stradling said:

He’s owed $64 million over 3 years plus I think a $5 million buy out of the following year, but I could be mistaken.  Regardless, if the Yankees pay half, you’re replacing a good player with a worse player and your paying him more.  So outside of acquiring a really nice piece for Kole I certainly wouldn’t entertain this. 

I would assume they would have to throw in a piece in order to make any deal happen along with paying half or more. Ellsbury has a little better all around game than Calhoun the last 3 years (although he's not as durable). Lets say it costs the team 10 mill a season and we get a prospect in return I can see that being worth it based on the marginal difference between the 2 players.

[Angel Oracle]

Okay Albert, that's 3 million extra reasons to get your act together in 2018.

[Cosmo_Kramer]

3 hours ago, Stradling said:

That seems wrong.  I mean wouldn’t this be the easiest way to circumvent the tax ever.  You write an easy to achieve goal for Trout and have his base salary be $10 million and have the other $20 million be bonuses?

The AAV doesn't change, but the bonus is included in the luxury tax the year it is earned. So yes, it does count.

[eligrba]

1 hour ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

What do you guys think about Ellsbury. If the yanks are really willing to pay at least half of the remaining contract we could move Calhoun and get our leadoff hitter for a decently cheap price.

Jerry, is that you?

[Cosmo_Kramer]

3 hours ago, Stradling said:

So it does count against the luxury tax number?  

Yes

[Cosmo_Kramer]

1 hour ago, ettin said:

 

The original question was does it count against the AAV cap and it does not.

MLB and the Player's Union regulate contracts to ensure no one is handing out performance bonuses that are out of whack. For instance you don't promise a player that if he pitches 1 inning he gets a $5M performance bonus. MLB and the Player's Union would be against that (MLB believing the organization is trying to circumvent the CBT threshold while the Player's Union will be wondering why that money isn't guaranteed in the contract in the first place).

When the Angels offered Pujols the $10M personal services contract and added in those performance bonuses it was not viewed very kindly by MLB but because it was such a monster contract a $3M performance bonus wasn't looked at as an oddity. Also MLB shut down the ability for teams to provide personal services contracts after a player has retired because of what happened with Albert.

Any performance bonus that is earned will be added to actual club payroll for that season. However in terms of the Luxury Tax and AAV a performance bonus is not added into the calculation for determining AAV, only signing bonuses (of which I believe Albert received a $10M one initially if I recall correctly).

So to summarize the Luxury Tax threshold is not impacted by a performance bonus.

AAV is not affected, but the luxury tax calculation is affected.

[Cosmo_Kramer]

1 hour ago, ettin said:

And here is the relevant part of the new CBA:

(4)

Performance, Award and Other Bonuses

(a) Any amounts that are actually earned by a Player as Perfor-

mance Bonuses, Award Bonuses or any other bonuses properly

included in a Uniform Player’s Contract shall be included as part of

the player’s Salary in the Contract Year in which the service or per-

formance giving rise to the Bonus was provided. Potential bonuses

shall not be included in the AAV calculation made pursuant to Sec-

tion E(2) above

 

Correct. Not included in the AAV calculation. But they are added to the luxury tax calculation for the year they are earned.

[AngelsLakersFan]

41 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

Ellsbury has a little better all around game than Calhoun the last 3 years (although he's not as durable). 

In what world?

[Chuck]

Yu Darvish indicated Wednesday night on his personal Twitter account that he is deciding between six teams.

Darvish was responding to a report from Jeff Wilson of the Fort Worth-Star Telegram, which stated that the free agent starter has received ongoing interest from the Rangers, Yankees, Cubs, Astros, and Twins. "I know one more team is in," Darvish replied. That team could be the Dodgers, as Andy McCullough of the Los Angeles Times tweeted Wednesday that it is his "understanding" the reigning NL champions are still in the mix "despite the financial hurdles." Darvish signing this week could finally unclog a free agent market that has been stagnant all winter for both starting pitchers and position players.

Source: Yu Darvish on Twitter

 

[Chuck]

I know one more team is in. https://t.co/exxubGP7Qo

— ダルビッシュ有(Yu Darvish) (@faridyu) January 11, 2018

Hopefully the other team is the Angels.

[jordan]

The more I think about our rotation, the more I doubt Eppler will pursue another SP.  But then I think about being in the playoffs and how we really don't have a go-to guy.  Of course Richards is the obvious choice, but I mean we don't have anyone with any experience.  I know experience is overrated, but it still worries me some.  I'd rather have experience than no experience.  I'm kind of rambling because I'm really torn whether I'd like Eppler to pursue Darvish or not.  I would not go over 5 years for sure. 

[krAbs]

I think Darvish would be great - for the right cost. If Eppler pulls off a miracle and gets him cheap? Great! We will have one of the best rotations in modern history (assuming health, and some of our potential comes together). If not? We'll be fine. Let someone else overpay for a guy who can't stop projecting his next pitch to the Astros.

[Hubs]

I think we may see a one or two year deal for an arm, but I doubt they're going to give anyone a 5 year deal. And that's what Arrieta and Darvish both want.

They also said they don't want to give up a draft pick for a free agent, but if they could get it back the following year, perhaps they'd be open to that.

[Angelsfan1984]

26 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

In what world?

Steals, Less strikeouts, Walks, OPS, XBH...still left handed and can hit at the top of the order. I'm saying that the difference between the 2 players is marginal but if you can get a prospect and not have to pay the entirety of that salary I think its an upgrade to the overall health of the roster/minors.

[Ohtaniland]

2 hours ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

What do you guys think about Ellsbury. If the yanks are really willing to pay at least half of the remaining contract we could move Calhoun and get our leadoff hitter for a decently cheap price.

They should picked up Brett Gardner. He can play all three different OF positions. Too bad there’s no room in the everyday lineup because he would be the Angels best leadoff hitter. The Yankees would probably give him away because they’re stuck with Ellsbury and because of the acquisition of Stanton and with the emergence of Judge, Hicks and Frazier they are already loaded in the outfield. Gardner is only owed for one more season.

[Warfarin]

1 hour ago, Cosmo_Kramer said:

Correct. Not included in the AAV calculation. But they are added to the luxury tax calculation for the year they are earned.

This is correct.  From all reputable sources that I have read, it is indeed counted as part of the luxury tax calculation.  It is discussed frequently with regards to the Dodgers and Kenta Maeda, as his contract is almost entirely bonus-based for various IP and GS achievements.  Any kind of bonus is counted to the luxury tax THAT year it is achieved, but it is NOT counted as part of AAV for future years.  So this year, Pujols' luxury tax hit is 3 million higher than it will be in other years.

Thus, as of now, our luxury tax AAV is roughly 175mil for this year, INCLUDING the projected Pujols bonus (as well as arbitration, players on minimum contracts, etc).

So we have, roughly, 20-22mil of space left.  Keep in mind we need to save probably 5-7mil for midseason acquisitions.  Thus, we have roughly 15-17mil left of luxury tax AAV to play with, which is why IMO, Darvish isn't coming.

[Angelsfan1984]

1 minute ago, OHTANILAND said:

They should picked up Brett Gardner. He can play all three different OF positions. Too bad there’s no room in the everyday lineup because he would be the Angels best leadoff hitter. The Yankees would probably give him away because they’re stuck with Ellsbury and because of the acquisition of Stanton and with the emergence of Judge, Hicks and Frazier they are already loaded in the outfield. Gardner is only owed for one more season.

I'd actually prefer Gardner. I forgot about him. Not sure the prospect would come with him, but he would be a welcomed edition to the top of the lineup. I really wish Calhoun hadn't regressed like he did last year. I had high hopes for his breakout year not being a fluke.

[totdprods]

On 1/9/2018 at 2:45 PM, totdprods said:

Angels may be settling with a lot of players today to avoid arbitration. Here's the projections, via MLB Trade Rumors.

Martin Maldonado (5.156) – $2.8MM
Garrett Richards (5.148) – $7.0MM
Blake Wood (5.131) – $2.2MM (Angels settled at $1.45m, per Fletcher 12/1)
Matt Shoemaker (3.166) – $4.4MM
Tyler Skaggs (3.135) – $1.9MM
Blake Parker (3.036) – $1.7MM (Angels settled at $1.8m, per Heyman 1/11)
Jose Alvarez (3.035) – $1.1MM
C.J. Cron (3.097) – $2.8MM
Cam Bedrosian (2.153) – $1.2MM
Andrew Heaney (2.150) – $800K (Angels settled at $800k plus award bonuses, per Heyman 1/9)
J.C. Ramirez (2.139) – $2.6MM

Updated, Parker and Angels settled.

[Stradling]

If I could get Gardner for basically nothing, I do that and move Kole.  But the Yankees won’t give him away, he is a consistent 3 WAR player and last year was almost a 5 WAR player.  They aren’t giving him away. 

[Hubs]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

If I could get Gardner for basically nothing, I do that and move Kole.  But the Yankees won’t give him away, he is a consistent 3 WAR player and last year was almost a 5 WAR player.  They aren’t giving him away. 

Exactly.

[AngelsLakersFan]

29 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

Steals, Less strikeouts, Walks, OPS, XBH...still left handed and can hit at the top of the order. I'm saying that the difference between the 2 players is marginal but if you can get a prospect and not have to pay the entirety of that salary I think its an upgrade to the overall health of the roster/minors.

Calhoun has been worth 5 more wins than Ellsbury has the last three years, and it isn't just because of Jacoby's missed time as Calhoun has been a significantly better hitter on a per plate appearance basis.