The Official 2017-2018 Hot Stove Thread

[arch stanton]

I think another factor may be the possibility of cost controlled talent on the market. Why sign An expensive free agent when it’s still possible to trade for Yelich or Archer? If you’ve got a few prospects to dangle you might get a much better bargain 

[Chuck]

On 12/29/2017 at 8:46 AM, AngelsFaninGA said:

That's an obscene contract. Rockies will regret it. 

From Joe Sheehan: "Wade Davis just isn’t special any longer. Among relievers with at least 40 innings pitched last year, he was 18th in ERA, 19th in ERA+, 19th in K/9, 92nd in K/BB, 87th in fastball velocity.”

[wopphil]

5 hours ago, arch stanton said:

I think another factor may be the possibility of cost controlled talent on the market. Why sign An expensive free agent when it’s still possible to trade for Yelich or Archer? If you’ve got a few prospects to dangle you might get a much better bargain 

This is a good point. Archer, Cole, Machado, and Yellich could all be depressing the markets for their free agent counterparts. 

[wopphil]

15 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

From Joe Sheehan: "Wade Davis just isn’t special any longer. Among relievers with at least 40 innings pitched last year, he was 18th in ERA, 19th in ERA+, 19th in K/9, 92nd in K/BB, 87th in fastball velocity.”

He may not have been as dominant as in prior years, but he was still excellent. No reason to think he won't continue to be very good.

[arch stanton]

$17 mil a year for a reliever he better be more than very good 

[Ochocinco!]

Fking snooze fest continues

[Stradling]

We need to stop blaming Boras.  The players dictate these things.  If JD Martinez wanted things settled by a certain date then it would have been.  He could have said to Boras, my family and I want to sign by Christmas and this is the area (west coast, east coast) that I’d prefer.  Get us the best deal you can by then.  

[Blarg]

Once he says get us the best deal Boras will try and turn the screws on clubs. Make no mistake, Boras does not want to devalue his client list by making a discounted deal for any single player early on.

[Stradling]

It’s hardly early on.  Both of Arods huge contracts were signed the second week of December.  Same with Heywards contract.  Players decide these things not Boras.  

[Angel Oracle]

Admittedly, Weave gives Strad’s statement some teeth.

Who thought back in 2011 that Weave would sign a 5 years/$85 million deal?   There were certainly numbers higher than that being thrown around.

Granted, that was to stay with the same team.

[Stradling]

I don’t need the Weaver contract to prove my point.  It’s incredibly simple, the agent is hired by the player.  The player can put deadlines on the agent.  If the agent doesn’t deliver then your demands are too high or you have a bad agent. 

[ukyah]

8 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

December 31, and we know where Borass’ FAs are:  sitting home pissed off that their agent has scared teams off with his stupid requests and 70 page portfolios that read like government regulations.

only the ones with nervous dispositions. boras almost always gets his clients the money, and it's usually very late in the offseason when it seems like there are no suitors left. 

the issue that i think will arise this offseason is that there are too many guys looking for the massive boras payday. i think this one will be a game of musical chairs and someone's going to be left without a seat.

[eligrba]

The "client calls the shots" is too simple and not always reflected in what actually happens.  I know lots of "clients" who are routinely manipulated by "established professionals." Greed has a way of complicating simplicity.

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, eligrba said:

The "client calls the shots" is too simple and not always reflected in what actually happens.  I know lots of "clients" who are routinely manipulated by "established professionals." Greed has a way of complicating simplicity.

It’s still on the player.  Just like it’s Artes fault if Sosh has too much power.  

[Troll Daddy]

Once you sign a pack with the devil ... your soul is his forever 

[JarsOfClay]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

It’s still on the player.  Just like it’s Artes fault if Sosh has too much power.  

Will you stop constantly needling other posters on this board?  It's almost every single post you make now.  I dont even know who you're referring to in this one, but it's getting annoying.

[Stradling]

24 minutes ago, JarsOfClay said:

Will you stop constantly needling other posters on this board?  It's almost every single post you make now.  I dont even know who you're referring to in this one, but it's getting annoying.

Whatever Mr. Negative.  And if you don’t know who I’m referring to then how bout you butt out.  I am stating my opinion, if you don’t like it, simply mark me as a troll (like you commonly do) and go about your merry negative way.  

Edited December 31, 2017 by Stradling

[Docwaukee]

Still think Boras has a ton to do with this.  

Boras clients don't take lesser multi year deals.  Weaver is the only one I can think of ever.  

If the market doesn't play out as expected, they take a one year deal at the end of the off season.  

It's certainly not just his clients that are causing this.  

The relief market is on time.  1b pretty much as well.  But certainly not SP or the big money position players.  

The reason I think Boras clients are still a big part of this is that usually the top of the market gets set first and then everyone else falls in line.  Boras, on the other hand, waits for the market to develop.  He plays off desperation.  

But who's desperate?  Or willing to spend a bit more that they probably should?

BOS - probably.  But they are essentially looking for that one bat.  

NYY - maybe but I doubt it.  They are finally below the CBT threshold and likely want to stay that way.  I see them making a trade more than signing a big time FA.  

TBR, TOR, or BAL?  don't think so.  

 

CLE, KCR, CWS or DET? - nope.

Min - maybe but unlikely to break the bank.  if they were going  to do so, I bet they would have already.  

 

HOU - doubtful.  I could see them waiting out the market for an unexpected upgrade.

LAA - See Hou. 

SEA or TEX - maybe.  could see Texas pony up but they'd likely have to get rid of some salary.  SEA is a wild card.  but I doubt they spend big on a pitcher.  

OAk - nope

 

WAS - maybe.  and they have history with Boras.  But they're pretty set across the board.

MIA, ATL, PHI, NYM - nope

 

CHN - doubtful.  don't see them overpaying.  

MIL - maybe.  Like the Twins, they probably aren't desperate as much as willing if the price is right.  

STL - doubtful.  I could see them spending a bit, but not in a desperate way.  

CIN, PIT - nope

 

LAD - doubtful.  they'll spend if it works but I don't see them going nuts.  They just made a big play to get under the CBT.  

ARI - maybe.  but restricted by payroll.  would need to trade Greinke to add a big money guy.  

COL - doubtful.  Pretty set.  Don't see them going big on anyone else now that they've put a ton of money on their pen

SDP - doubtful.  Probably willing to spend, but not in a desperate way.  

SFG - probably.  Their window is close and they don't want to admit it.  Could see them stupidly adding a big money starter of JD Martinez.  

 

So you really only have two probablys and several maybes.  I think Boras has misjudged this market a bit.  If I were a non boars client right now, I'd be taking the best deal in front of me.  

Tell you what though.  I could handle a Darvish deal at 4/100.  I doubt it as it seems more likely he gets a Cueto type deal. 

But there is going to be some guys left standing.   

  

 

[eligrba]

It would be fun to watch Darvish and Ohtahni pitch together.

[Blarg]

There are over 150 players listed as free agents. There are probably less than 60 openings out there. 

The Angels grabbed Cozart,  that was listed as 3rd ranked free agent (ESPN rankings),  for a reasonable cost and only a 3 year deal essentially killing Moustakas value.

Every player currently signed is 3 years or less. I think owners have instructed GMs they are not taking on any long term deals that extend past 5 years and only for the elite players.

[Bobster7587]

1 hour ago, eligrba said:

It would be fun to watch Darvish and Ohtahni pitch together.

Two guys one rubber? 

[Tank]

if i were a player, i would have final say. i'd let my agent know what i'm looking for and negotiate accordingly, but it would rest on my shoulders. i've always assumed that's how pro athletes do it, too, but the reality is that none of us have been in on any of the negotiation process or are privy to exactly how these things work. we go off a lot of rumor and innuendo and supposition, but you and i simply don't know what it's like to be in the room with boras and a GM. 

[tomsred]

5 hours ago, Bobster7587 said:

Two guys one rubber? 

Have we lowered ourselves to this - fighting over rubbers?

[tomsred]

3 hours ago, Tank said:

if i were a player, i would have final say. i'd let my agent know what i'm looking for and negotiate accordingly, but it would rest on my shoulders. i've always assumed that's how pro athletes do it, too, but the reality is that none of us have been in on any of the negotiation process or are privy to exactly how these things work. we go off a lot of rumor and innuendo and supposition, but you and i simply don't know what it's like to be in the room with boras and a GM. 

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.....blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.....blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[Blarg]

 $ $$,$$$,$$$.$$ x 8

Edited January 1, 2018 by Blarg