Remember when....

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, Farmbuildingfan said:

I do give credit where it is do. The Angels would have one of the better staffs in baseball if not for the unprecedented injuries.

However, I readily admit that my cynicism  still exists largely do to a lack of trust for Moreno.

The Pujols. Hamilton. Wells, and Greinke  acquisitions still disturb me.

Rational organizations don't do these things..

I am not concerned with Eppier. He is sure a better choice than Dipoto.

Yet when Dipoto was with Arizona, he made a good deal for Arizona that hurt the Angels. Then next year he comes to the Angels and makes another trade that hurt the Angels.

This makes me think that Dipoto was doing Moreno's bidding.

Thank goodness we now have Eppier instead.

You are correct that this will not get fixed overnight, but we also will not know how much wiser the organization has become overnight  either.

If the Angels keep getting younger and better, my cynicism will fade. 

 

 

The Cubs traded for Chapman and didn't resign him.  That seemed to work out.  Dipoto sucked, the drafts sucked not because of Moreno, but because of Dipoto.  Lack of international prescense is Dipoto signing the wrong guy.  Stop with the Moreno stuff as it relates to the farm.  

[Farmbuildingfan]

3 minutes ago, Stradling said:

The Cubs traded for Chapman and didn't resign him.  That seemed to work out.  Dipoto sucked, the drafts sucked not because of Moreno, but because of Dipoto.  Lack of international prescense is Dipoto signing the wrong guy.  Stop with the Moreno stuff as it relates to the farm.  

So Moreno has had no say in approving draft choices, trades, or acquisitions?

Didn't the Angels lose prospects., draft choices, or other acquisitions because it was Moreno who wanted to invest in Pujols, Hamilton, and Greinke?

You know more about the Angels inside responsibilities and decisions than I do no doubt, but I have a hard time believing Moreno has little to do with this.

Regardless of the past, I sure hope that everything is now in Eppier's hands.

[Blarg]

4 hours ago, Dochalo said:

Trout was a big Yankee fan and Yankee fans hated us for quite a stretch during the early 2000's because we owned them.  

In all likelihood, Mike Trout hated the Angels.  

Mike Trout

I was definitely a Phillies fan. I managed to get to a couple a year -- I was about fifty minutes from Philly.

 

[eligrba]

Remember when Street closed games for the Angels?

Good times.

[Angelsjunky]

I thought the OP was going to say "...Cameron Maybin was good?"

Dude is hitting .143 in his last 11 games.

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, Farmbuildingfan said:

So Moreno has had no say in approving draft choices, trades, or acquisitions?

Didn't the Angels lose prospects., draft choices, or other acquisitions because it was Moreno who wanted to invest in Pujols, Hamilton, and Greinke?

You know more about the Angels inside responsibilities and decisions than I do no doubt, but I have a hard time believing Moreno has little to do with this.

Regardless of the past, I sure hope that everything is now in Eppier's hands.

While I am not positive, I highly doubt Arte has any thing to do with a draft pick since probably Jered Weaver and that was based on signability. I guess you could add that starting pitcher that we drafted and didn't sign that went on the NC before being signed by the Mets.  As far as the issues with losing draft picks for signing free agents like Albert or Hamilton, how does Boston or the Yankees seem to do it?  They are always signing free agents and have good farms.  

[Inside Pitch]

28 minutes ago, Stradling said:

As far as the issues with losing draft picks for signing free agents like Albert or Hamilton, how does Boston or the Yankees seem to do it?  They are always signing free agents and have good farms.  

They spent over slot and signed lots of international players.   Neither team can do that any longer -- everyone is locked into their signing bonus money..  Moving forward it's really going to come down to how well teams scout..... both tools and metrics.

If 4 years from now the Angels are being talked about as a top 5 system, then an argument could be made that Eppler outperformed every other GM in the team's history.  Stoneman's teams spent first round money on guys in the teens (Trumbo, Adenhart), they had several Draft and Follow signings, they were able to bid whatever they wanted on guys like Ervin, Morales, etc etc...   Say what you will, Weaver was considered a signability guy that the Angels rolled the dice on, and then signed.  They wouldn't be able to do any of those things anymore, it's simply not allowed.

The next few years are going to be really interesting from a development POV for us and everyone else.

 

[Docwaukee]

6 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

They spent over slot and signed lots of international players.   Neither team can do that any longer -- everyone is locked into their signing bonus money..  Moving forward it's really going to come down to how well teams scout..... both tools and metrics.

If 4 years from now the Angels are being talked about as a top 5 system, then an argument could be made that Eppler outperformed every other GM in the team's history.  Stoneman's teams spent first round money on guys in the teens (Trumbo, Adenhart), they had several Draft and Follow signings, they were able to bid whatever they wanted on guys like Ervin, Morales, etc etc...   Say what you will, Weaver was considered a signability guy that the Angels rolled the dice on, and then signed.  They wouldn't be able to do any of those things anymore, it's simply not allowed.

The next few years are going to be really interesting from a development POV for us and everyone else.

 

Agree.  

Also, losing a mid to late first round pick or not getting a supplemental won't crush you if you don't do it all the time and if you get a player worth far more than the value of that pick.  Especially if you end up trading away a few of those guys for prospects here and there.  

Like you mentioned, the real kicker was the missed opportunity on the international side.  While teams were using their financial power to manipulate the rules, we not only chose not to do that but we sat on the sidelines completely.  Again, we ignored 1/3rd of the prospect pool for 6 or 7 years.  Imaging if we didn't get to draft a 3rd, 6th, 9th, 12th, 15th, 17th, 20th etc pick for 6-7 years in a row.  While some teams instead got two picks from each of those rounds for several years in a row.  

Even if you are considered mediocre to poor at scouting, the sheer volume of players coming into your system would result in more talent over the long haul instead of filling those spots with your 30th round pick who's been languishing at age 24 is A ball.  

The only manipulation left is the 11th-40th picks and going under slot for your first 10 picks.  And even that is fairly limited.  You aren't getting 1-3 round talent with those picks.  

[eligrba]

31 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

They spent over slot and signed lots of international players.   Neither team can do that any longer -- everyone is locked into their signing bonus money..  Moving forward it's really going to come down to how well teams scout..... both tools and metrics.

If 4 years from now the Angels are being talked about as a top 5 system, then an argument could be made that Eppler outperformed every other GM in the team's history.  Stoneman's teams spent first round money on guys in the teens (Trumbo, Adenhart), they had several Draft and Follow signings, they were able to bid whatever they wanted on guys like Ervin, Morales, etc etc...   Say what you will, Weaver was considered a signability guy that the Angels rolled the dice on, and then signed.  They wouldn't be able to do any of those things anymore, it's simply not allowed.

The next few years are going to be really interesting from a development POV for us and everyone else.

 

Red Sox have already figured out how to increase the international signing money they have available.  Why the hell didn't someone in the Angels front office come up with this idea?

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/07/red-sox-acquire-international-bonus-money-from-reds.html