The Official 2017-2018 Anaheim Ducks Thread

[gotbeer]

7 minutes ago, nate said:

WTF are you talking about?  For one thing, Kesler, Perry and Getzlaf are signed long term... second off, they have a shitload of young guys on the team, that is the problem right now, no vets.

You can't call up every young prospect there is on the Gulls or you start the clock on them now and get totally fucked long term.

Richie, Kase, Grant, Wagner, Silf, Montour, Lindholm, Manson, Rakell, Kosilla, Roy, Shaw are all young.  Hell, Vatanen and Cam too.

Next year we will probably see Welinski and Larssen and maybe a couple forwards, but that is it.

4 of the top 6 are hurt, nobody on the Gulls can fill that in.

None of the people I listed, minus what I would expect a really good return for in Vatanen and Silfverberg, are signed long term.  Almost all are UFA's after this season.  This season is not worth holding on to them, when we can get picks or young prospects in return.  

And BTW, Wellinski, Kerdilles, Roy, Kossilla, and Tropp are all unrestricted free agents after this season.  

[nate]

Silf, Montour, Vatanen, Rakell and Manson are the only players on the Ducks with any trade value and outside of Vatanen, trading them would set the Ducks back years.

[gotbeer]

Add Megna to the list of UFA next season.  

[nate]

All of them can be brought back for the minimum, some of them even minor league contracts

[UndertheHalo]

At what point do we just have the injuries as an excuse for putrid play though Nate ? Lack of offensive zone time does put pressure on the D but what we’re seeing isn’t that simple.  We have the full complement of Dmen.  Most of them are Dmen who profile as good at transitioning out of the zone.  Bad offensive teams can defend and compete.  The Ducks are not competing.  That’s my problem.  I don’t know how many times we’ve seen guys deep in the Ducks zone make unforced or weak turn overs.  Or fail to clear the zone when there’s danger.  That’s the D’s job man.  They just aren’t getting it done.  Regardless of the forwards inability to maintain possession.  The forwards are proving to be worthless, so we need a coaching adjustment that just hasn’t come yet.  I think fans are right to criticize the coaching staff for that.

We can throw away the Chicago game.  Everyone was awful.  But what about the Winnipeg game ? The Vegas game.  These guys, and I’ll keep harking on this.  Defensemen like Lindholm and Vatanen.  Fowler.  The Ducks need these guys to step up.  Fowler has only been back a couple of games.  He’s been on and off.  Which I’m willing to give him a break for.  But Lindholm and Vatanen.  Their play is unacceptable.  Throw Manson into that mix.  

Bob Murray’s vision has apparently been having this young mobile D core around these guys.  I’m not interested in excuses for them.  They’re healthy.  They’re all playing.  So far in their moment to step up they’ve been terrible.  And these aren’t tough luck losses.  They are getting fucking smashed.  So hey, maybe GB is right.  If it’s not gonna work blow the whole fucking thing up.  Trade guys and re tool.  Bob didn’t pull the trigger to make impact acquisitions waiting on this D group to come together and it maybe cost us trips to the cup finals.  I can deal with losing, but I don’t want to see players like Hampus Lindholm and Sami Vatanen roll over.  And IMO.  That’s what we’ve got and it fucking sucks. 

Also, i pick on Lindholm a lot.  I think it’s fair.  But you know who else is trash ? Silvferberg and Rakell.  Both those guys have been incredibly disappointing and deserve to be targets of frustration.

Edited November 28, 2017 by UndertheHalo

[HaloCory22]

I don't think you can rebuild the Ducks as they are. Too much invested in Getz, Perry, Kesler to do that. They aren't too far off though. The only guy you can trade right now offensively is Cogs. As much as I'd love Cogs to be gone it doesn't make sense. He wouldn't bring in anything astounding in a trade. Vatanan could net us something at FW at the cost of our defense. (Which I'm okay with tbh. We're deep enough to contend still just gotta hope we don't get too banged up) If we had a rookie putting up some real production that would be nice. Sure, Grant and Wagner have been producing but definitely not to the level we need. I'd love for Steel to get a chance. Debrincat got his shot in Chicago, why not Sam?

 

Moral of the story, Ducks can't rebuild. They have nothing to rebuild with right now for the most part. They aren't going to trade Gibson, Silf, Ritchie, Montour, etc. etc. Now THAT is a full blown rebuild. If only the Ducks could pull a Blackhawks and get a rookie to come out of no where.

[UndertheHalo]

I don’t think we need to rebuild necessarily.  But I’m open to trading a guy like Silvferberg and of course Vatanen.  Just to get some new blood into the organization. 

[HaloCory22]

11 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

At what point do we just have the injuries as an excuse for putrid play though Nate ? Lack of offensive zone time does put pressure on the D but what we’re seeing isn’t that simple.  We have the full complement of Dmen.  Most of them are Dmen who profile as good at transitioning out of the zone.  Bad offensive teams can defend and compete.  The Ducks are not competing.  That’s my problem.  I don’t know how many times we’ve seen guys deep in the Ducks zone make unforced or weak turn overs.  Or fail to clear the zone when there’s danger.  That’s the D’s job man.  They just aren’t getting it done.  Regardless of the forwards inability to maintain possession.  The forwards are proving to be worthless, so we need a coaching adjustment that just hasn’t come yet.  I think fans are right to criticize the coaching staff for that.

We can throw away the Chicago game.  Everyone was awful.  But what about the Winnipeg game ? The Vegas game.  These guys, and I’ll keep harking on this.  Defensemen like Lindholm and Vatanen.  Fowler.  The Ducks need these guys to step up.  Fowler has only been back a couple of games.  He’s been on and off.  Which I’m willing to give him a break for.  But Lindholm and Vatanen.  Their play is unacceptable.  Throw Manson into that mix.  

Bob Murray’s vision has apparently been having this young mobile D core around these guys.  I’m not interested in excuses for them.  They’re healthy.  They’re all playing.  So far in their moment to step up they’ve been terrible.  And these aren’t tough luck losses.  They are getting fucking smashed.  So hey, maybe GB is right.  If it’s not gonna work blow the whole fucking thing up.  Trade guys and re tool.  Bob didn’t pull the trigger to make impact acquisitions waiting on this D for come together and it maybe cost us trips to the cup finals.  I can deal with losing, but I don’t want to see the players like Hampus Lindholm roll over.  And IMO.  That’s what we’ve got and it fucking sucks. 

No team is going to look good offensively when you have Grant, Wagner, Vermette, and Rasmussen as your 4 Cs. The only scorer we have is Perry right now and he's been a shell of his former self even with this little scoring push he's had recently.

I do agree that the defensive production hasn't been what we expected either. Fowler was a ghost offensively last night. Vatanen has been meh too. Hampus has never been an offensive threat imo. Him on the PP is a terrible decision. Issue too I think is the D knows the team won't score a lot so they put more emphasis on the D but end up being too cautious and it slows down their offensive production quite a bit.

[Pujols4MVP]

1 minute ago, HaloCory22 said:

Debrincat got his shot in Chicago, why not Sam?

Exactly, it frustrates me that a tiny 5'7 forward drafted same year as Steel like him got a chance given that Steel produced slightly more points in about the same amount of games played, about even i guess but Steel is about average height at 6'0. The Ducks will rush a D-man but not a let a forward who did all he could at the junior level get a cup of coffee in the NHL.

I'd bet on it that Steel would at least be semi productive this year if given the chance. DeBrincat would be sitting in the juniors if he was with the Ducks.

[HaloCory22]

7 minutes ago, Scioscia4MVP said:

Exactly, it frustrates me that a tiny 5'7 forward drafted same year as Steel like him got a chance given that Steel produced slightly more points in about the same amount of games played, about even i guess but Steel is about average height at 6'0. The Ducks will rush a D-man but not a let a forward who did all he could at the junior level get a cup of coffee in the NHL.

I'd bet on it that Steel would at least be semi productive this year if given the chance. DeBrincat would be sitting in the juniors if he was with the Ducks.

I think the reason is a business decision. I believe it was Nate who said it earlier in this thread. Steel not being with the Ducks right now is solely due to the fact they don't want to start his clock yet. Too young and too valuable to bring up now and start the clock on. If he was a Matthews/McDavid talent I don't think they'd hesitate to bring him up but that isn't the case here.

[gotbeer]

1 hour ago, HaloCory22 said:

I think the reason is a business decision. I believe it was Nate who said it earlier in this thread. Steel not being with the Ducks right now is solely due to the fact they don't want to start his clock yet. Too young and too valuable to bring up now and start the clock on. If he was a Matthews/McDavid talent I don't think they'd hesitate to bring him up but that isn't the case here.

But that's the thing.  You can bring Steel up for 11 games, and not really start his clock.  Just like they did with Larrson last year, having him start the season before going off to Sweden.  11 games right now of Steel and Jones could be the bridge to Getz and Kess.  And hell, if they freakin shine, then start the clock and let them shine.  

[gotbeer]

Dang, I just looked at the Magnetos stats.  Shea Theodore has 1 goal and 4 assists in 8 games with them already.  That point total is greater than our defensemen of Vatanen, Fowler, Bieska, Beauchemin, and Holzer.  

[UndertheHalo]

Aside from starting the clock (a real issue) Steel just isn’t ready for the NHL yet.  No point in damaging his development.  He’s unlikely to help the Ducks.

[gotbeer]

2 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Aside from starting the clock (a real issue) Steel just isn’t ready for the NHL yet.  No point in damaging his development.  He’s unlikely to help the Ducks.

So then why let Larrson start last season when he was 18?  Clock and damaging his development are cop outs.  

[gotbeer]

Blackhawks’ Patrick Kane fined $5K for slash on Ducks’ Nick Ritchie

What Ritchie did was penalty worthy.  What Kane did was dangerous.  I agree with the fine.

[gotbeer]

Really good stat sheet of how our prospects are currently doing.  

http://nhl.bamcontent.com/images/assets/binary/293452898/binary-file/file.pdf

[UndertheHalo]

16 minutes ago, gotbeer said:

So then why let Larrson start last season when he was 18?  Clock and damaging his development are cop outs.  

It’s not GB, Larrson has played pro hockey and has a much more developed game.  

both Steel and Jones stuck out in camp as amateur players.  Steel in particular is undersized.  Both need some pro seasoning in the AHL before they should play in the NHL.  Guys that are rushed do get messed up.  It’s not uncommon. 

[Pujols4MVP]

1 hour ago, UndertheHalo said:

It’s not GB, Larrson has played pro hockey and has a much more developed game.  

both Steel and Jones stuck out in camp as amateur players.  Steel in particular is undersized.  Both need some pro seasoning in the AHL before they should play in the NHL.  Guys that are rushed do get messed up.  It’s not uncommon. 

Debrincat is 5'7 & had nearly indentical points in the juniors last year as Steel, then again he could suddenly get rocked by a hit & miss a ton of games.

[UndertheHalo]

4 hours ago, Scioscia4MVP said:

Debrincat is 5'7 & had nearly indentical points in the juniors last year as Steel, then again he could suddenly get rocked by a hit & miss a ton of games.

I’m specifically referencing his bulk.  He needs to add weight.  Look, he may be able to come up and score some goals.  He’s talented.  I just don’t see the benefit of bringing up a guy to play with Grant/Wagner/Vermette.  He’s not going to benefit from the experience.  He may develop bad habits because he’s not prepared for the pro game.  As I mentioned that’s a thing that happens with guys who are rushed.  He’s unlikely to impact the team in a significant way.  And imo that’s the bigger thing.  He’s probably not going to make a difference so why roll the dice ?  It’s just not a great idea imo.  I guess a short 11 game stint wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world. 

I’m as frustrated as any of you, I would love to think Steel could come up and instantly inject the forward corps with some talent.  Just seems really unlikely .

Edited November 29, 2017 by UndertheHalo

[nate]

You guys are so crazy man.

You don't call up Steel now just for a few games and send him back for a couple years til he is ready.  Imagine if the Ducks did that, then called him back up when they think he is ready and it turns out he isn't, well now they have started the clock on him and he has to figure things out in the minors or toil away on the fourth line.

The D is getting exhausted every game because they are spending it chasing forwards and fighting for the puck deep in the D zone.  Without any offensive possession the D never get any easy shifts.  It is the same reason they aren't putting any offense on the ice, instead of being able to hang back near the blue line and perhaps get a point shot away or pinch down the boards they are always going for a change because they just spent the last 90 seconds chasing the puck in their own zone.

There isn't one team in the league that could win without 4 of their top 6 and definitely without their top 2 centers.

[gotbeer]

Vermette.  Gets lucky on a goal.  Then makes 2 stupid plays and puts himself in the box.

[gotbeer]

That was a nice pp goal by Fowler to Roy.

[gotbeer]

Who are these people in white, and where have they been?

[UndertheHalo]

Lol what the fuck is going on.  This team is so dumb.  

Hold on and and I’ll be real happy with this one. Like I said before.  If these guys somehow managed to win 2 or 3 of these road games it’ll be incredible. 

[gotbeer]

Another stupid penalty by the Ducks.  They really don't want to win this one easily.