Arte Moreno Speaks

[kevinb]

Like I said before if Mike is not gone this upcoming year than he is tied to Eppler and only when/if Eppler is fired Mike will be fired. 

[Stradling]

Kevin, if they haven't fired Mike before this season then why would you fire him for this season?

[Stradling]

If you want to fire him because he's missed the playoffs 6 of 7 years then go ahead, but then he should have been fired after a season where he had the talent and fell short, not in a season devoid of talent. 

[Blarg]

11 hours ago, CALZONE said:

Jose Altuve 2b
4 years/$12.5M (2014-17), plus 2018-19 club options

 

Now that's what a smart contract looks like.

He was an amateur free agent out of Venezuela. It's not like they were paying for a known commodity that had MLB experience. Instead of club control for six years the Astros are looking at him hitting the free agent market after next year. They may not be able to afford him by that time so that contract may have been short sighted. 

[Blarg]

46 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

The Angels are on pace to win about 67 games this year. When was the last time the Cardinals won less than 70 games in a non-strike shortened season? (1978) Or how about the Dodgers who like to be at the start of a long run? (1992) And what about the Yankees, a team who rebuilt its minor leagues while staying in the wild card hunt, when was the last time they finished just under .500? (1992) 

I'm not trying to imply that things aren't cyclical, they are, but seasons like this, and situations like the one the Angels are in currently only happen when you ignore sustainability and think only about the short term. Great examples of down years in the Arte Moreno era are 2003, 2004 and 2010. Look at all the time lost to the DL in those two seasons (due to the aging core or one that left via FA - now thats an example of being cyclical) and yet look at the results, a .475 winning percentage, a first round exit in the post season and 80 wins. 

We should have higher expectations than this.

Good job finding three teams out of 30. Now look at the AL West and tell me about all the consistency going on there. 

[eligrba]

15 minutes ago, Kevinb said:

Like I said before if Mike is not gone this upcoming year than he is tied to Eppler and only when/if Eppler is fired Mike will be fired. 

Instead of getting rid of Scioscia, maybe he needs to be promoted to the front office?

[kevinb]

1 hour ago, eligrba said:

Instead of getting rid of Scioscia, maybe he needs to be promoted to the front office?

He definitely knows how to pick em. Vernon and Mathis over Napoli 

[kevinb]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

Kevin, if they haven't fired Mike before this season then why would you fire him for this season?

Huh no I said if he's not fired this season. Then he's here as long as Eppler is. No chance Eppler is here 2 years with mike and then gets to hire his own manager. They both have 3 seasons or they are both gone and it's a total rebuild of front office and manager etc

[Amazing Larry]

2 minutes ago, Blarg said:

Did any of you have some expectations the team wouldn't have down years? Historically every team after a decade of success drops off for a few years,  why is it a shock that the Angels are no different? Well perhaps the laws of physics cease to exist on your hot stove! 

 

Magic grits aside, the Angels have one of the highest payrolls in baseball. At the very least they should be above .500. 

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, Lawrence said:

Magic grits aside, the Angels have one of the highest payrolls in baseball. At the very least they should be above .500. 

Yes if Arte spent on the right players and if he emphasized deleoping the farm. 

[Stradling]

7 minutes ago, Kevinb said:

Huh no I said if he's not fired this season. Then he's here as long as Eppler is. No chance Eppler is here 2 years with mike and then gets to hire his own manager. They both have 3 seasons or they are both gone and it's a total rebuild of front office and manager etc

Of course if he's still here in two years he will be allowed to hire the next manager.

[Troll Daddy]

11 minutes ago, Kevinb said:

Huh no I said if he's not fired this season. Then he's here as long as Eppler is. No chance Eppler is here 2 years with mike and then gets to hire his own manager. They both have 3 seasons or they are both gone and it's a total rebuild of front office and manager etc

You're on to something ... Eppler will give Scioscia a five year extension in the off season. 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

13 hours ago, Erstad Grit said:

...Angel fans wanted Heyward who now has the worst contract in baseball

I believe that we have an insurmountable lead in the bad contract game.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

3 hours ago, Blarg said:

Did any of you have some expectations the team wouldn't have down years? Historically every team after a decade of success drops off for a few years,  why is it a shock that the Angels are no different? Well perhaps the laws of physics cease to exist on your hot stove! 

Down years are one thing. It takes a special kind of incompetence, however, to achieve the exacta of a weak major league roster and an almost totally barren minor league system.

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

I just want to know when Arte is going to sign the deal to bring old-timers day to the Big A. 

 

And of course I mean Yankees old timers day at the Big A.  

[Amazing Larry]

10 minutes ago, SoToSpeaks said:

I just want to know when Arte is going to sign the deal to bring old-timers day to the Big A. 

 

And of course I mean Yankees old timers day at the Big A.  

Then you'll get to beat off to Arod again. 

[tdawg87]

Did anyone honestly think Mike would get fired after this year? It makes zero sense at this point. 

It's not his fault he was handed a shitty bullpen and a UCL tear orgy extravaganza.

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

10 minutes ago, Lawrence said:

Then you'll get to beat off to Arod again. 

There's only so much halo soft porn starring willits, Mathis, Nava, Gentry and all the other Judies over the year.   I need some stiff pinstripe porn.  Maybe angels who were Yankees. 

 

Washington

Winfield

polonia 

rickey

reggie

 

[tdawg87]

1 minute ago, SoToSpeaks said:

There's only so much halo soft porn starring willits, Mathis, Nava, Gentry and all the other Judies over the year.   I need some stiff pinstripe porn.  Maybe angels who were Yankees. 

 

Washington

Winfield

polonia 

rickey

reggie

 

Don't forget Chad "Lou" Curtis.

[Docwaukee]

the 'everything cycles' argument has a little bit of merit yet for the halos it's also a bit of a cop out.  

Yes, winning teams have less opportunity because of lower draft picks.  Of course, you can't trade away major league talent for prospects.  And sometimes it makes sense to forfeit a first round pick for the right piece.  So all those things contribute.  Those are accepted places where you miss because you are trying to win.  

Bad decisions like the Hamilton contract and lesser so the Pujols one are somewhere in the middle.  Too many poor choices will help sink the ship as well.  

But there are other places we missed big time and it's those misses that have led to us being where we are.  They were misses that didn't have to be.  It starts with pumping a disproportionately large percentage of your resources into the major league club.  You generate the 7th highest revenue in all of baseball.  That makes you a big market club.  There were significant opportunities in place to take advantage of having those resources and as we all know, the lack of player development and in particular on the international side was a killer.  When you take yourself out of a third of the available player pool, you are going to suffer.  Imagine if we had to give up one of every three draft slots.  That's essentially what we did for a period of about 5-7 years.  

It was a cascade effect.  The starting point from where the decisions originated was wrong, so the path that resulted was unlikely to get you where you needed to go.  

[Blarg]

12 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

Down years are one thing. It takes a special kind of incompetence, however, to achieve the exacta of a weak major league roster and an almost totally barren minor league system.

When you only follow closely one team you gloss over the ineptness of other franchises. The Blue Jays blundered their way through the leagues ever since their run in the '90's, never quite getting their shit together until recently. Cleveland is the same story along with the rise and fall of the Twins, the Rays going almost 10 seasons not making it to .500, the Royals going 35 years of suck and the A's that are the biggest roller coaster team in the league where they are either contenders for the playoffs or a top 5 draft pick. Need we say more about the Mariners 116 win banner?

We are at the end of a 14 year run, the most productive the Angels have ever had as a franchise. The bill came due so we pay it and move on. If you guys can't handle it try going back to being Rams fans.

 

 

[Docwaukee]

3 minutes ago, Blarg said:

When you only follow closely one team you gloss over the ineptness of other franchises. The Blue Jays blundered their way through the leagues ever since their run in the '90's, never quite getting their shit together until recently. Cleveland is the same story along with the rise and fall of the Twins, the Rays going almost 10 seasons not making it to .500, the Royals going 35 years of suck and the A's that are the biggest roller coaster team in the league where they are either contenders for the playoffs or a top 5 draft pick. Need we say more about the Mariners 116 win banner?

We are at the end of a 14 year run, the most productive the Angels have ever had as a franchise. The bill came due so we pay it and move on. If you guys can't handle it try going back to being Rams fans.

 

 

most of those teams don't have the resources we have.  

[Angel Oracle]

4 hours ago, Blarg said:

Did any of you have some expectations the team wouldn't have down years? Historically every team after a decade of success drops off for a few years,  why is it a shock that the Angels are no different? Well perhaps the laws of physics cease to exist on your hot stove! 

 

Or their biological clock is ticking?

[Vegas Halo Fan]

I have never been a Rams fan, but thanks for the suggestion.

This minor league system isn't just barren. According to many who follow and analyze the game for a living, it is historically bad - which means that we have totally sucked at scouting.

[Angel Oracle]

6 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

I have never been a Rams fan, but thanks for the suggestion.

This minor league system isn't just barren. According to many who follow and analyze the game for a living, it is historically bad - which means that we have totally sucked at scouting.

Or drafted too many high floor/low ceiling guys from 2012-2015 (coughDipeuteredcough)