So What's the Plan for 2017?

[Docwaukee]

So I think there are three different directions we can go:

1.  Do almost nothing.  Maybe add a couple of 1yr deals.  But pretty much just stand pat this off season and kick the can down the road

2.  Sell off more parts for younger talent.  Would you sell Calhoun?  Simmons? Shoe?  Escobar?  

3.  Buy.  Move some minor league parts to improve the rotation.  Sign Cespedes for LF.  Bring in a high end closer.  

 

Personally, I am inclined to keep Calhoun and Simmons but shop Escobar and maybe Shoemaker depending on the return.  Then to do some stop gap deals otherwise.  I don't think I would spend much money and I certainly wouldn't move any minor leaguers for 2017 upgrades.  

 

Thoughts?

[Docwaukee]

1 minute ago, cezero said:

if you sell off everything of value you have not named trout (so very little) then you have to commit to a full rebuild.

is that really something moreno would choose to do?

 

Nope.  Especially with a few arms potentially returning from injury in 2018.  

[Troll Daddy]

Don't sell ... SPEND the MONEY 

[DMVol]

I go with #1.....I think we'll go the Nava/Gentry route again....I'll have to see a willingness to from Arte to spend to think things will change....

[gurn67]

Considering Arte's track record, throwing $100,000,000+ at Bautista to play left is probably plan A. Plan B is probably trading for Ryan Braun.

[Angels#1Fan]

The Angels are in a "catch-22" because of the injuries that decimated the starting rotation for what will be close to two years. It's why Shoemaker isn't likely to be traded. The Angels need more pitchers, not less.  So, due to the injuries they are left with trying to rebuild the starting staff practically from the ground up. How they might do this is problematic regardless of what kind of approach is used. It's already been established that there isn't anything on the farm to bring up and the free agent market is lacking. Counting on Skaggs, Richards, Heaney, and Trop would be foolish because there is no guarantee on who may or may not return. Plus there isn't any guarantee on how effective or durable any of them might be when they do return. Just look how slow Skaggs has been to rebound. Besides which he's had very limited success to begin with. The Angels are going to need a lot of luck rebounding from all these injuries. It's not like they've lost a couple of key players for a couple of months. 

[Troll Daddy]

17 minutes ago, Angels#1Fan said:

The Angels are in a "catch-22" because of the injuries that decimated the starting rotation for what will be close to two years. It's why Shoemaker isn't likely to be traded. The Angels need more pitchers, not less.  So, due to the injuries they are left with trying to rebuild the starting staff practically from the ground up. How they might do this is problematic regardless of what kind of approach is used. It's already been established that there isn't anything on the farm to bring up and the free agent market is lacking. Counting on Skaggs, Richards, Heaney, and Trop would be foolish because there is no guarantee on who may or may not return. Plus there isn't any guarantee on how effective or durable any of them might be when they do return. Just look how slow Skaggs has been to rebound. Besides which he's had very limited success to begin with. The Angels are going to need a lot of luck rebounding from all these injuries. It's not like they've lost a couple of key players for a couple of months. 

Pitching is a problem for all teams. Losing Heaney and Tropeano isn't the end of the world. 

Take a look at some of the potential playoff teams starting pitching. 

[Cdaniel]

Since we need pitching I'd like to take one or two flyers one 1 or 2yr deals on pitchers and position players If it works out maybe we can flip them at the deadline.  Not sure who those flyers would be.  

[Docwaukee]

24 minutes ago, cezero said:

i'm sorry. 

i'm not trying to kick any team while they're down, especially since my own has been such a shit show forever. 

but basing future decisions for the team on "a few arms potentially returning from injury in 2018" is bat shit crazy. 

 

It depends actually.  you can hedge your bets to some degree.

[stormngt]

Spend to get a lock down bullpen.  Get a left fielder.  I will be happy with Reddick.  Bring Cowart up to play 3b or 2nd base.

Weakness in starting pitching can be covered by a great bullpen.  See 2002 for an example.  We have had a crappy pen ever since KROD left

[Ohtaniland]

We're right back to waiting for Morales to return. We can only hope that Richards and Skaggs don't re-injure themselves in 2017 and that there's no setbacks with the other pitchers.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

1 hour ago, cezero said:

if you sell off everything of value you have not named trout (so very little) then you have to commit to a full rebuild.

is that really something moreno would choose to do?

The key phrase here is "of value". I can think of maybe four players on the roster (other than Trout) who another team might trade for.

[Angelsjunky]

Trade Hector Santiago for a top prospect. Continue to give Chacin and Lincecum starts to build their trade value.

Oh, wait...

[Ohtaniland]

Make Nolasco your Ace. 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

 

[gotbeer]

#1.  Or see the Ducks.  Next years FA class is almost as bad as the Angels farm system.  Let the stupid overpay.  Then pick up the pieces towards the end to fill in what we need on cheap short deals.

 

Although.  With next years FA class being so bad.  Teams may be looking to acquire players at a premium.  So if someone is willing to overpay, then we should listen.

Edited August 19, 2016 by gotbeer

[gotbeer]

Second part of the question.

Chances are, we will have a top 10 pick.  So when a player is given a qualifying offer, and say he is a fringe player like this past offseasons Fowler.  Do you make a deal and give up the 2nd round pick?  Fowler as a QO, turned down a $15 million dollar deal, and eventually re-signed with the Cubs for $8 million and a $9 million mutual option. 

[Ohtaniland]

1 hour ago, gurn67 said:

Considering Arte's track record, throwing $100,000,000+ at Bautista to play left is probably plan A. Plan B is probably trading for Ryan Braun.

Arte is saving his money for Bryce Harper.

[totdprods]

Eppler has said often enough that this team has the resources to both build for the future and still aim to compete, and I don't think that's fantasy. I feel that was already implemented this past offseason, and think we will see a similar approach this winter. They'll acquire some players, but do so without committing much money or trading away a lot of prospects. Shorter commitments and vets that can be easily flipped if things go south again. 

Presuming we get a protected pick, I would take advantage of that scenario and go into the offseason looking hard at FAs with a pick attached, and take advantage of that for once.

1) Make a serious run at one of Josh Reddick, Jansen, Hellickson, Desmond, or Fowler. Reddick is the most appealing to me as he won't cost a pick, has success in the AL West, and badly fills a need - good left-handed hitter, defense, outfielder. Hellickson would be a great fit, but with his age and the thin SP class, he's probably going to get far too much money. Fowler would be nice, but not sold on him leaving CHI and he may as well be too pricey. Desmond feels too risky - he was awful early in the year and I can see that happening in Anaheim. I would pass on Trumbo, Chapman, and Cespedes - too much risk for the price. I had a lot of interest in Wilson Ramos a couple weeks back, thinking it'd allow the Halos to flip one of Bandy/Perez for a good SP prospect, but starting to really like that tandem.

2) If the above doesn't happen, get one of Jon Jay, Rajai Davis, Michael Saunders, or Franklin Gutierrez for LF. Of these, I think Jay provides the best fit. Bottom line, we need to get LF addressed and get someone who will do better than a sub-.600 OPS, be it Reddick or Rajai. 

3) If either of the above happen, weigh offers on Kole Calhoun, and if someone offers enough, pull the trigger and commit to signing two OFs. 

4) if you went cheap in the OF, consider one of Prado/Walker/Turner for 2B/3B or Nova/Fister for the rotation. One of these would be a reasonable cost and full a need without breaking the bank or being untradeable. 

5) Also put Escobar on the block - if someone offers enough, great, if not, hang onto him until someone does, even if it means Cowart stays at SLC. 

After that, the usual - sign an old vet reliever on a one year, a minor league invite to one or two of Weaver/Wilson/Lincecum/Chacin.

Also important, we are also moving up in the Rule 5 draft order. Keep a spot open and try and snag someone again this year. Basically free talent.

Keep Street as closer and hope he builds enough value to deal in July. Keep Shoe as we need someone to pitch in 2017. If he makes it through the year, make him available in the offseason or next deadline to bring in a better haul and address needs we need to fill by that time.

[Docwaukee]

25 minutes ago, cezero said:

it depends on what?

in what universe does any fan or owner think hedging bets on arms coming back from injury has anything to do with legitimate attempts to build a roster that can compete?

the angels have no farm, so the choice is build a farm from the ground up, or rely on moreno to spend mega millions on more FA's that work out. arms coming back from injury should have virtually zero to do with any decisions. 

 

you haven't been tracking the halos much lately have you.  Regardless,  Teams take into consideration guys coming back from injury all the time.  To say it has zero to do with the decision making process is ridiculous.   Should they count on it?  Probably not, but coming back from TJ is a decent bet.  

So you hedge your bets a bit.  The Angels have a little bit of time relative to the guys with the most value.  Kole is controlled thru 2019.  Simmons and Shoe thru 2020.  So maybe you wait a bit.  Perhaps till mid 2018.  

Don't get me wrong, it's not looking all that great any way you slice it, but you have to calculate your odds.  You've got Trout for the next 4 years so ideally, you'd like to somehow take advantage of that.  Are you better off hanging on to some guys for an extra 18 months in the hope that you can have some semblance of a rotation by 2018?  Or do you sell now in hopes that your return gets you back to being competitive by 2020 so you can entice Trout to stay.  

Like I said, I don't really like either option all that much, but I think the odds are better if you keep everything intact for 2018 vs. the farm system being good enough to produce a competitive team by 2020.  

But If I get a premium for any one of Shoe, Simmons or Calhoun then I would consider moving them.  

I'm also factoring in what I think they are gonna do as we are pretty far from what I would have done.  Doesn't mean I would have been right, just means that both seem to be very different.  

[arch stanton]

I wouldn't be inclined to commit to anything 100% until we see what happens with the CBA. Even with the free agent class being weak it's going to be a mad scramble in February for anyone who believes themselves to be fringe contenders. Eppler may be able to score another near ready pitcher in the process.

[Stradling]

I would go after Desmond or Fowler and Chapman.  I want a left fielder that can hit and play defense, players that have a little pop but can run the bases.  Like I've said in other threads I want athletes.  

[Troll Daddy]

Rebuilding in hopes of keeping Trout will never happen ... Idiotic at best. 

[Docwaukee]

1 minute ago, Troll Daddy said:

Rebuilding in hopes of keeping Trout will never happen ... Idiotic at best. 

Agree.  Just don't think there is any chance it happens quick enough.  

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

42 minutes ago, totdprods said:

I would pass on Trumbo, Chapman, and Cespedes - too much risk for the price.

Cespedes has preformed every where he has played, with the possible exception of Boston. He didn't much care much for Boston, anyway.