Can this trend be reversed? SJWs

[Thomas]

1 hour ago, Thomas said:

Oh it'll have an impact for sure...  That's what deeply concerns me.

As I was saying...
http://www.citylab.com/crime/2017/02/inauguration-protesters-targeted-for-facebook-searches/515517/

[mtangelsfan]

7 minutes ago, red321 said:

I didn't realize the job of a representative was to only listen to, or meet with, people who would vote for him/her.

Not quite what I said exactly but for the most part that is true.  They are going to try to please the folks that voted for them.

[red321]

I would think that should bring more people to the streets rather than silence people.

[Thomas]

4 minutes ago, red321 said:

I would think that should bring more people to the streets rather than silence people.

Yes but not like Tea Partiers. They have to be more saavy. Understand that when you protest everyone on your friends list becomes vested by your actions.

[red321]

1 minute ago, mtangelsfan said:

Not quite what I said exactly but for the most part that is true.  They are going to try to please the folks that voted for them.

Members of congress are always looking ahead, especially in the house. And how do you know people protesting are people who didn't vote for them? Or, if your are a representative and thousands of your constituents are showing up demanding you don't support repealing ACA, at least without a replacement...at a minimum you are going to think twice about doing it. If it happens enough...you go back to DC and say...hey...guys...maybe we should rethink this a little. And if you still go ahead and vote for repeal...people who may not have voted in the last election...suddenly they start getting more active and working for your opponent. Maybe one of those people becomes your opponent.

 

 

[red321]

1 minute ago, Thomas said:

Yes but not like Tea Partiers. They have to be more saavy. Understand that when you protest everyone on your friends list becomes vested by your actions.

yeah, I'm thinking the issue here isn't protestors...but rather governmental overreach, unless your suggestion is that people shouldn't give the feds a reason to overreach...in which case doesn't that really just mean their intimidation tactic worked?

[Thomas]

2 minutes ago, red321 said:

Members of congress are always looking ahead, especially in the house. And how do you know people protesting are people who didn't vote for them? Or, if your are a representative and thousands of your constituents are showing up demanding you don't support repealing ACA, at least without a replacement...at a minimum you are going to think twice about doing it. If it happens enough...you go back to DC and say...hey...guys...maybe we should rethink this a little. And if you still go ahead and vote for repeal...people who may not have voted in the last election...suddenly they start getting more active and working for your opponent. Maybe one of those people becomes your opponent.

They are probably paying more attention to advanced social media analytics than partisan protests involving those rather unlikely to be sway at the ballot box.

[Thomas]

Just now, red321 said:

yeah, I'm thinking the issue here isn't protestors...but rather governmental overreach, unless your suggestion is that people shouldn't give the feds a reason to overreach...in which case doesn't that really just mean their intimidation tactic worked?

Just because intimidation tactics are wrong doesn't mean they aren't effective. I have numerous reservations around me to remind one of that.

[red321]

pretty clear why libertarian party is stuck in the 4%-5% range

[Thomas]

12 minutes ago, red321 said:

pretty clear why libertarian party is stuck in the 4%-5% range

The same reason the two choices were Trump and H. Clinton?

[mtangelsfan]

16 minutes ago, red321 said:

pretty clear why libertarian party is stuck in the 4%-5% range

Because voters are dumb?

[Thomas]

1 minute ago, mtangelsfan said:

Because voters are dumb?

Nah. That would elitist at best and very likely untrue in the sense that intelligence isn't an indicator of political affiliation. However since corporate money only flows into the two majority parties and having more than two would be a major hit to the ROI on this money spent...  But since Red and many on the left don't want to be outside the two party system despite clearly more aligning with platform of parties such as the Green because of the perceived irrelevancy they have to compromise.

[mtangelsfan]

Because voters act foolishly during elections.

 

and because the system is rigged for the two major parties.

[red321]

20 minutes ago, Thomas said:

The same reason the two choices were Trump and H. Clinton?

Not sure pointing out the libertarian party could only pull 4-5% against two of the most unliked candidates in modern history, and probably had less impact on the election than Jill friggen Stein, makes your point.

[Thomas]

Just now, red321 said:

Not sure pointing out the libertarian party could only pull 4-5% against two of the most unliked candidates in modern history, and probably had less impact on the election than Jill friggen Stein, makes your point.

Then you misconstrued my point.

[red321]

11 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Nah. That would elitist at best and very likely untrue in the sense that intelligence isn't an indicator of political affiliation. However since corporate money only flows into the two majority parties and having more than two would be a major hit to the ROI on this money spent...  But since Red and many on the left don't want to be outside the two party system despite clearly more aligning with platform of parties such as the Green because of the perceived irrelevancy they have to compromise.

I'm not sure folks like myself would align more with the Green party, at least as it currently exists with people like Jill Stein at the helm.

Politics is compromise, as you yourself mentioned the Democratic Party is a big tent with a lot of constituencies. I may not like how close the centrist wing of the party has gotten to Wall St. but it certainly is better than going back to the housing crash years, and it certainly is worth is when you consider social issues, environmental issues, etc.

So, if supporting a party I don't 100% agree with, because on most of the issues that matter to me I'm aligned and can select candidates I agree with...well, I could be a libertarian or green and get 0% of what I want.

[Thomas]

Just now, red321 said:

I'm not sure folks like myself would align more with the Green party, at least as it currently exists with people like Jill Stein at the helm.

Funny I said platform, not those they manage to run given the long odds. Yet you chose to overlook that part to instead make your point...

2 minutes ago, red321 said:

So, if supporting a party I don't 100% agree with, because on most of the issues that matter to me I'm aligned and can select candidates I agree with...well, I could be a libertarian or green and get 0% of what I want.

Did anyone in the 1990s make a bigger impact on domestic policy than Ross Perot's continued attack on the national debt in his campaign, pie charts and all? The one both the Republican congress and Bill Clinton take credit for?

6 minutes ago, red321 said:

So, if supporting a party I don't 100% agree with, because on most of the issues that matter to me I'm aligned and can select candidates I agree with...well, I could be a libertarian or green and get 0% of what I want.

Your plan is working swimmingly right now.  Though seriously did you have anything to counter my points previous to your Libertarian snipe distraction?

[red321]

47 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Funny I said platform, not those they manage to run given the long odds. Yet you chose to overlook that part to instead make your point...

Did anyone in the 1990s make a bigger impact on domestic policy than Ross Perot's continued attack on the national debt in his campaign, pie charts and all? The one both the Republican congress and Bill Clinton take credit for?

Your plan is working swimmingly right now.  Though seriously did you have anything to counter my points previous to your Libertarian snipe distraction?

I've yet to understand what you are advocating for...and really, I'm not sure if it makes a difference...to borrow from MT...you aren't going to vote for the Democratic party anyways, you aren't their target audience.

You don't like the protests...you think they're pointless? ok. There are some clouds, go yell at them.

 

[gotbeer]

1 hour ago, mtangelsfan said:

Because voters act foolishly during elections.

 

and because the system is rigged for the two major parties.

Not only is it rigged for the two major parties.  But in the case of the Democrats, it was rigged within to make sure Clinton start from 3rd base in a run around the bases. 

[Thomas]

5 minutes ago, red321 said:

I've yet to understand what you are advocating for...and really, I'm not sure if it makes a difference...to borrow from MT...you aren't going to vote for the Democratic party anyways, you aren't their target audience.

You don't like the protests...you think they're pointless? ok. There are some clouds, go yell at them.

What?!?  Are you just assuming what I'm going to say and skimming the reading portion of the program?  It would explain quite a bit. Or is it just easier to argue at strawmen?

I was pretty damn happy with the Standing Rock protests...you know except for the eventual outcome. But that would be inconvenient for your point I assume. I'm saying the left better be pretty damn careful. You guys pull what the tea party did and you'll be discredited. The right doesn't play fair. They'll paint you as extremist, through legitimate and illegitimate means and not only obscure what your message is but use it as justification to pull out actions from the draconian bag.  They'll make spraying protesters with water in sub-frigid temperatures seem like an average day on the Miami beach. This administration appears to be playing for keeps. There will be blood. I would hope the left, which clearly I'm attaching myself to for the time being, understands the responsibility they/we undertake and are up for the challenge.
 

[red321]

They took a moderate like Obama and painted him to be a Kenyan Mooslim Socialist. After decades of this, you get used to it. Because, here's the secret...they are going to do it regardless. But at this point, there isn't much of a choice if the alternative is Steve Bannon and Donald Trump's vision of the world. This doesn't mean pop on the Guy Fawkes mask and go out and break shit up, loot, riot, etc. You are right, that is counter productive...but so far a vast majority of these protests have been peaceful and if the feds want to intimidate peaceful protesters maybe that will wake more people up. With today's camera/social media culture...let's be honest. Seeing grandma, or young kids, bloody on the street...not going to go over with white middle america like sicking dogs on blacks in the south or beating hippies on the streets of Chicago.

Though I'm not sure it gets to that. You would have to think the Paul Ryan's of the world know's their grift is over if that happens.

[Thomas]

Just now, red321 said:

They took a moderate like Obama and painted him to be a Kenyan Mooslim Socialist. After decades of this, you get used to it. Because, here's the secret...they are going to do it regardless. But at this point, there isn't much of a choice if the alternative is Steve Bannon and Donald Trump's vision of the world. This doesn't mean pop on the Guy Fawkes mask and go out and break shit up, loot, riot, etc. You are right, that is counter productive...but so far a vast majority of these protests have been peaceful and if the feds want to intimidate peaceful protesters maybe that will wake more people up. With today's camera/social media culture...let's be honest. Seeing grandma, or young kids, bloody on the street...not going to go over with white middle america like sicking dogs on blacks in the south or beating hippies on the streets of Chicago.

Because all those fucks people are giving for Standing Rock? BLM? People don't give a shit about minorities getting abused. They're conditioned to it. And right now the white culture as a whole supports Trump. And they scare so easily. The vast majority being peaceful isn't enough. It's easy enough to distort a few exceptions into something that will scare people. Of course they'll just make up shit if they have to. And right now peaceful protests aren't always going to happen. What's been a trending topic right now?  The left debating the merits of punching Nazis? There is a very sizeable portion that doesn't want to be peaceful. The powers on the right will have a field day with that. We have a single rightwing troll going around campuses and making people lose their shit. What happens when one in flesh troll becomes 100,000? Antagonizing and baiting? Honestly we need someone with the stature of Obama to lead an organized and civil resistance. 

[Thomas]

The election was CLEARLY viewed differently between the right and left. The left as a whole assumed after 8 years of social progress that the culture war was basically over and they won. That Trump was an anachronism or at least played one on TV to a doomed ideology. The liberal youth hadn't known a different world. They refused to take the right seriously. The right thought differently. They saw the election as the final line in the stand. The right will stomach many atrocities while remaining in their cognitive dissonance. They fear the change the country was heading into socially. Do not rely on the general good of society. Do not underestimate the right's resolve. This is the hurdle the left faces. It's not insurmountable. The playing field always changes. Perhaps the administration will overplay its hand. But right now the left is losing ground they can ill afford to for seemingly petty matters.

[RallyMo]

12 hours ago, Thomas said:

The right will stomach many atrocities while remaining in their cognitive dissonance. 

It sure seems to be the case.

[red321]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/college-republicans-sorry-hitler-valentines-card

Damn snowflakes can't take a joke

The College Republicans group handed out gift bags to students Wednesday night, including one with a card that said "my love 4 u burns like 6,000 jews." It had a photo of Adolf Hitler and was signed "XOXO, Courtney."