Making Trout the Leadoff Batter

[laagamer]

40+ HR in the leadoff spot? Shakin' things up, I like it...not.

[VariousCrap]

Heyward is a pipe dream. So is anyone who will require a first round pick in compensation. 

 

 

 

Heyward is 26 years old.  You give up a first round pick for him.  He is both young enough and good enough.

Edited October 8, 2015 by VariousCrap

[Mark68]

No. You don't have a 40 home run hitter leading off. That would be a waste.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Mark68

[Blarg]

Why not? This offense was electric with Trout leading off. I can spare 10 home runs for better run production. Plus, just cuz he leads off doesn't mean he's going to be hitting a ton of solo shots... SLG% isn't all about homers...

 

Ask yourself, do we still have the same roster when Trout was the leadoff hitter his rookie year, not specific personnel but talent? 

 

That answer is no and even if we did Trout is not the same player he was as a rookie so it wouldn't reap the same rewards. He has become a #3 hitter which means the Angels need to develop/acquire a more talented leadoff and #2 hitter to feed runners to him to knock in. 

 

Pujols is becoming a toothless tiger, Calhoun has his own issues in terms of being a well rounded hitter so there is nothing that the Angels can put behind Trout to be run producers. So stack it up in front and try and lengthen the order after him with something productive, or in other words and overhaul but moving Trout to leadoff neither solves any problems nor creates more offensive productivity.

[Troll Daddy]

A toothless Tiger who hits 40 Hrs and drives in 95 runs. Pujols is still a very productive player and feared by most pitchers.

That being said ... putting him a spot or two down in the lineup couldn't hurt.

Good stuff

[Guest]

A toothless Tiger who hits 40 Hrs and drives in 95 runs. Pujols is still a very productive player and feared by most pitchers.

That being said ... putting him a spot or two down in the lineup couldn't hurt.

Good stuff

I agree 100% re: moving him down the lineup. Just away from Trout at least.

Edited October 8, 2015 by failos

[Blarg]

His Obp was sub. 300. He will get fewer and fewer pitches to drive now that his skill set has regressed to the point he can't get on base through pitch recognition. Without a complete overhaul of his plate approach he will quickly dissappear as a hitter. I don't think he will submit to change because at this point his only achievable goals are based around where he ends his career on the all time home run list.

[Blarg]

On the topic of home run list, if Albert is going to crack the top 10 he will need 24 to bump ex teammate McGuire to 11th. 27 to pass Robinson then it is 50 to pass Sammy Sosa a player in his era. That is at least two to three years of grinding out lucky swings so for those that think he is retiring soon, there are too many reachable names on the list.

[Tank]

I think the Angels need to work on developing Johnny G into a lead off hitter.  Johnny batted .272 AVG this season with a .318 OBP.  I believe this can be improved upon.  I think if the Angels and Johnny work at it, he could become a .280 AVG/.350 OBP type of hitter, which would be perfect for the team.

He reminds me of David Eckstein. I like this idea.

[The God of Runs]

He's gotten to fat to lead off

[Blarg]

You simply don't just wave the magic leadoff hitter wand and a player suddenly becomes a. 350 Obp hitter. Giavotella is 27, he is what he is and isn't going to jump 30+ points in his on base stats, he isn't that talented.

[DoubleOffTheWall]

Figgins was way better than all these players mentioned except Trout obviously. and people complained about him. He went from a pinch runner to a legit .390 OBP with a nice glove who could play 5 positions. Sad how far we've fallen. 

[ABC]

Heyward is a pipe dream. So is anyone who will require a first round pick in compensation. 

 

Trout should bat 2nd or 3rd based on who they acquire for left field and second base plus other positions.

 

I think they need a leadoff hitter and to split up Pujols and Trout with a lefty power bat preferably.

 

Calhoun could hit after Trout, or after Pujols. 

 

It all depends on who they get in FA or via trade.

 

Pujols and Hamilton say hi.

[Guest]

Figgins was way better than all these players mentioned except Trout obviously. and people complained about him. He went from a pinch runner to a legit .390 OBP with a nice glove who could play 5 positions. Sad how far we've fallen.

Agreed. Figgins was an incredible player, he had nearly 190 hits, ~.400 OBP and 49 SB in 2009.

Too bad he turned into a grade A douche.

[Angel Oracle]

On the topic of home run list, if Albert is going to crack the top 10 he will need 24 to bump ex teammate McGuire to 11th. 27 to pass Robinson then it is 50 to pass Sammy Sosa a player in his era. That is at least two to three years of grinding out lucky swings so for those that think he is retiring soon, there are too many reachable names on the list.

Willie Mays' #5 spot is 100 HRs away. I have a feeling that will be his stopping point, because the top 4 by the time Pay-Rod retires will all have at least 700 HRs and Pujols can't get to that mark.

About 3-4 seasons should get Pujols pass 660 HRs and into the 5th spot all time. Then he can feel free to retire.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Angel Oracle

[19HALO71]

IMHO, the lead off hitter only leads off the game.  After the first inning you rarely see a lead off hitter starting off an inning. Normally I would agree that your best hitter should bat 3rd. However, with Pujols batting 4th it seems that Trout for whatever reason is not able to use his speed.There by eliminating one of his best tools. Because speed never goes into a slump. We have to accept that with Pujols we have become a station to station team. So batting Trout lead off and Pujols batting fourth, it gives Trout the ability to already be in scoring position when Pujols bats.

[mulwin444]

Where you bat Trout 1 through 3 is a little irrelevant considering he had few options to both drive in and to drive him in when he gets on base.  Batting him 1st means that, as the line-up returns to the top, the 7-9 hitters are the ones that are going to be setting the table and, if you think the .310-ish tendencies of Giavotella and Calhoun are bad, consider what dregs will be batting there.  Batting him third means there is at least a decent shot of "someone" being on base some of the time while batting him first decreased those odds considering who will be batting in front of him.  

Edited October 8, 2015 by mulwin444

[mulwin444]

Also, on a similar topic, I really don't get why Mike has a fetish for batting Aybar at lead-off...literally almost any option would be better.

 

2015 batting 1st: 210 AB .233/.270 OBP/.575 OPS

 

A .270 OBP when Aybar led off...Wow

 

By the way, for his career, Aybar has hit .269/.308 OBP/.680 OPS in 1,289 plate appearances from the lead off position.  How the hell did he get almost 1,300 chances there? 

[VariousCrap]

You simply don't just wave the magic leadoff hitter wand and a player suddenly becomes a. 350 Obp hitter. Giavotella is 27, he is what he is and isn't going to jump 30+ points in his on base stats, he isn't that talented.

 

 

Completely untrue.  A player can evolve and get better.  Baseball history is filled with them.

[Homebrewer]

By the way, for his career, Aybar has hit .269/.308 OBP/.680 OPS in 1,289 plate appearances from the lead off position. How the hell did he get almost 1,300 chances there? >>>

Scioscia just had a feeling about him, I guess.

[Tank]

Where you bat Trout 1 through 3 is a little irrelevant considering he had few options to both drive in and to drive him in when he gets on base.  Batting him 1st means that, as the line-up returns to the top, the 7-9 hitters are the ones that are going to be setting the table and, if you think the .310-ish tendencies of Giavotella and Calhoun are bad, consider what dregs will be batting there.  Batting him third means there is at least a decent shot of "someone" being on base some of the time while batting him first decreased those odds considering who will be batting in front of him.  

 

i think you've written a nice explanation of why being a baseball manager is a lot harder than most of us will admit.

[Blarg]

Completely untrue. A player can evolve and get better. Baseball history is filled with them.

Please list those that fall into Giavotella's skill set that had a dramatic change.

[Tank]

Completely untrue.  A player can evolve and get better.  Baseball history is filled with them.

 

i tried to look up stats for eckstein as a leadoff hitter (and failed miserably). what i found was that his average was usually a solid .280+ and his obp at least .339 (except towards the end of his career. what i was hoping to find was something that said "here's his obp as a leadoff hitter", but i couldn't find that on baseball reference.com.

 

what i remember as a fan was that he was pretty green when he arrived in anaheim and there were a lot of doubts about him hitting leadoff. he made it work and was a terrific table setter for us for his time here.

 

i don't know if he evolved as a better hitter or not as it looks like he didn't have any major league experience prior to being on the angels. in my heart, i'd like to believe that players can improve, and we know that confidence shown in them can go a long way. maybe that's what johnny g. needs, or maybe he won't ever be any better than what he is now. would it be unreasonable to give johnny g. the job as leadoff hitter next year and see how it goes? i'm not really sure he could do any worse than aybar, though that sets the bar extremely low.

[ispy45]

Ask yourself, do we still have the same roster when Trout was the leadoff hitter his rookie year, not specific personnel but talent? 

 

That answer is no and even if we did Trout is not the same player he was as a rookie so it wouldn't reap the same rewards. He has become a #3 hitter which means the Angels need to develop/acquire a more talented leadoff and #2 hitter to feed runners to him to knock in. 

 

Pujols is becoming a toothless tiger, Calhoun has his own issues in terms of being a well rounded hitter so there is nothing that the Angels can put behind Trout to be run producers. So stack it up in front and try and lengthen the order after him with something productive, or in other words and overhaul but moving Trout to leadoff neither solves any problems nor creates more offensive productivity.

This man gets it.

[Blarg]

By the way, for his career, Aybar has hit .269/.308 OBP/.680 OPS in 1,289 plate appearances from the lead off position. How the hell did he get almost 1,300 chances there? >>>

Scioscia just had a feeling about him, I guess.

Some of if was wishful thinking that Aybar would change his plate approach early in his career, more recently has been the lack of anyone else to fill the void.

Leading off Giavotella was a sub. 300 obp with a. 613 OPS (paying attention various crap?) as a number 9 hitter his was Trout light hitting. 322 with a. 376 Obp and .859 OPS. Some players fit certain roles well and batting 9th was Giavotella's best fit by far which did not translate to any other place in the batting oder.

Getting back to Aybar, he became the default because Calhoun was moved down I the order first to provide something after Pujols when Joyce and brain Freese were producing nothing. With Giavotella's success at 9th Scioscia was quoted as saying Aybar could do the little things like bunt a runner over which then placed Aybar leadoff with Calhoun second since he really was the 2nd most productive hitter behind Trout.

Any other options? Murphy had a sub. 300 Obp, Perez wasn't an option, you are not sticking Freese there and Featherston couldn't find first with a seeing eye dog.

Scioscia was stuck trying to extend the lineup before Trout and after Pujols with the crap he had to work with this season. Maybe we get something better to work with next season but this year he had Aybar, crazy swing at everything Aybar and nothing else.