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Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult
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AngelsRedRum
Posted 2013-01-03 7:26 PM (#1915687 - in reply to #1915672)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



All-Star

Posts: 3731

Location: Las Vegas
HaloMagic - 2013-01-03 7:00 PM

If he's not a bigot then why did you call him one? I understand that many people find Hunter's viewpoint distasteful. I would include myself in that group. But to imply he is a bigot with zero evidence to support it shows either a complete misuderstanding of the word or a disregard for accurately describing someone and their actions.


I'm not a fan of playing semantics, it was my silly way of conceding to LT's opinion.

The idea that being gay is wrong has bigotry all over it. No hate needed, just intolerance.


Edited by AngelsRedRum 2013-01-03 7:28 PM
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HaloMagic
Posted 2013-01-03 7:30 PM (#1915689 - in reply to #1915681)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 5418

cezero - 2013-01-03 7:22 PM

HaloMagic - 2013-01-03 7:00 PM

If he's not a bigot then why did you call him one? I understand that many people find Hunter's viewpoint distasteful. I would include myself in that group. But to imply he is a bigot with zero evidence to support it shows either a complete misuderstanding of the word or a disregard for accurately describing someone and their actions.


herp derp someday i in that knowing definition of the wordz

can i have using the interweb? yes?


oh
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skills
Posted 2013-01-03 7:30 PM (#1915690 - in reply to #1912832)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



AngelsLakersFan - 2012-12-30 7:34 PM

Halocory22 - 2012-12-30 7:29 PM

Imagine how this board will react once someone on here comes out of the closet. I wonder if it'l be difficult to post under those conditions.


Brandon



That guy was gay and left because of the insensitive gay remarks on AW? I haven't seen him here in while but I figured something happened.
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mtangelsfan
Posted 2013-01-03 7:31 PM (#1915691 - in reply to #1915687)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




AngelsRedRum - 2013-01-03 8:26 PM
HaloMagic - 2013-01-03 7:00 PM If he's not a bigot then why did you call him one? I understand that many people find Hunter's viewpoint distasteful. I would include myself in that group. But to imply he is a bigot with zero evidence to support it shows either a complete misuderstanding of the word or a disregard for accurately describing someone and their actions.
I'm not a fan of playing semantics, it was my silly way of conceding to LT's opinion. The idea that being gay is wrong has bigotry all over it. No hate needed, just intolerance.

That is total bs.  What matters is how you treat somebody.  I could take your "2000 year old book" comment to say you are bigoted toward Christians.  However, unless you treat them badly, you aren't.  You may be wrong, but that's ok. : )

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Lifetime
Posted 2013-01-03 7:32 PM (#1915692 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 29300

So you post definitions of a term and the cry semantics? LOL. The discussion was already semantics before I chimed in and you were part of it.

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HaloMagic
Posted 2013-01-03 7:34 PM (#1915693 - in reply to #1915691)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 5418

mtangelsfan - 2013-01-03 7:31 PM

AngelsRedRum - 2013-01-03 8:26 PM
HaloMagic - 2013-01-03 7:00 PM If he's not a bigot then why did you call him one? I understand that many people find Hunter's viewpoint distasteful. I would include myself in that group. But to imply he is a bigot with zero evidence to support it shows either a complete misuderstanding of the word or a disregard for accurately describing someone and their actions.
I'm not a fan of playing semantics, it was my silly way of conceding to LT's opinion. The idea that being gay is wrong has bigotry all over it. No hate needed, just intolerance.

That is total bs.  What matters is how you treat somebody.  I could take your "2000 year old book" comment to say you are bigoted toward Christians.  However, unless you treat them badly, you aren't.  You may be wrong, but that's ok. : )




This. Except for the first part of the last sentence.
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AngelsRedRum
Posted 2013-01-03 7:34 PM (#1915694 - in reply to #1915692)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



All-Star

Posts: 3731

Location: Las Vegas
Lifetime - 2013-01-03 7:32 PM

So you post definitions of a term and the cry semantics? LOL. The discussion was already semantics before I chimed in and you were part of it.



Let me rephrase. I cannot beat LT at semantics. So I'm not a fan of it when LT starts to play. :)
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mtangelsfan
Posted 2013-01-03 7:36 PM (#1915695 - in reply to #1915694)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




Weird that you keep complaining about LT yet his posts are the ones you keep responding to.
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cezero
Posted 2013-01-03 7:41 PM (#1915700 - in reply to #1915691)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Arkansas Travelers

Posts: 660

mtangelsfan - 2013-01-03 7:31 PM
That is total bs.  What matters is how you treat somebody.


there you go with implying the speaking is not an action

it's fine if you really believe that, but surely you realize it makes for a completely vaporous argument, right?

anyhoo, outside of here with the few of us who keep this thread going out of morbid curiosity (well, in my case anyway), this is literally yesterday's news. hunter doesn't strike me as a terrible guy. my own grandmother was a bigot in some ways, but a very nice person in others. whatever wilson suffers from this, it's probably more than he deserves. some of us will continue to be critical of anybody who makes statements like his, while other will tirelessly support the comments. whatever.

life goes on.
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mtangelsfan
Posted 2013-01-03 7:47 PM (#1915703 - in reply to #1915700)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




If voicing opinions were hurting people we should shut down every message board in the world.
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AngelsRedRum
Posted 2013-01-03 7:47 PM (#1915705 - in reply to #1915695)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



All-Star

Posts: 3731

Location: Las Vegas
mtangelsfan - 2013-01-03 7:36 PM

Weird that you keep complaining about LT yet his posts are the ones you keep responding to.


I thought it was more like praise than complaints.
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cezero
Posted 2013-01-03 7:48 PM (#1915706 - in reply to #1915703)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Arkansas Travelers

Posts: 660

mtangelsfan - 2013-01-03 7:47 PM

If voicing opinions were hurting people we should shut down every message board in the world.


profound

i'm going to really ponder that

and i mean it

i promise not to partake in extending this thread
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the dude abides
Posted 2013-01-03 7:50 PM (#1915707 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: RE: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




Location: Peru

Advice Yoda Gives - The semantics is strong  in this one

 

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mtangelsfan
Posted 2013-01-03 7:54 PM (#1915711 - in reply to #1915707)
Subject: RE: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




dude making solid contributions as usual.  
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the dude abides
Posted 2013-01-03 7:56 PM (#1915713 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




Location: Peru
MT acting as Lifetime's knight in shining armour, as usual.

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mtangelsfan
Posted 2013-01-03 7:59 PM (#1915717 - in reply to #1915713)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




At least I have actually been giving opinions in this thread, unlike ones who just post insults.  

 

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Lifetime
Posted 2013-01-03 7:59 PM (#1915718 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 29300

Does that make you uncomfortable dude?
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the dude abides
Posted 2013-01-03 8:01 PM (#1915722 - in reply to #1915718)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




Location: Peru
Lifetime - 2013-01-03 9:59 PM

Does that make you uncomfortable dude?


Not at all.

Torii might have an issue with it though.
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angelduck
Posted 2013-01-03 8:01 PM (#1915723 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Salt Lake Bees

Posts: 995

Good for Torii. Now a bunch of liberals have their panties in their wad because of his comments lol.

Edited by angelduck 2013-01-03 8:02 PM
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2002_halos
Posted 2013-01-03 10:14 PM (#1915798 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 15050

Location: WestCoast
wait

brandon is gay?
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Angels_for_life
Posted 2013-01-03 11:31 PM (#1915837 - in reply to #1915624)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 5002

AngelsRedRum - 2013-01-03 6:06 PM
Angels_for_life - 2013-01-03 5:54 PM I don't think people understand what it is to be a bigot. Torii being uncomfortable around gays does not make him a bigot, nor does him thinking homosexuality is wrong make him a bigot. Bigotry is defined as hate towards a group. I don't think this qualifies.
big·ot [big-uh?t] noun a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion. big·ot·ry [big-uh-tree] noun, plural big·ot·ries. 1. stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own. The word and/or description of hate is not found in any definition. (so says the internet)

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot

 

"a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance"

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yvangelfan
Posted 2013-01-03 11:47 PM (#1915840 - in reply to #1913742)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Cedar Rapids (Low-A)

Posts: 398

Ordos - 2013-01-01 12:30 AM

Blarg - 2012-12-31 8:39 AM

You should have found a way to work Freddie Mercury into the conversation.


I once slept with a British lesbian at the house of a gay man who kept on about how awesome Freddie Mercury was. Good times.


I once slept in the same bed with a British lesbo too. She was my brother's girlfriend, beautiful and very "friendly".

Anyway....back to the subject.

The person who wrote the article is a jerk. He should find another way to make a living.

I love Torii Hunter and I love my sister-in-law, who happens to be gay.

Inside Pitch, I agree with your comments. Cepedes, have a drink.
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the dude abides
Posted 2013-01-04 6:09 AM (#1915900 - in reply to #1915837)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




Location: Peru
Angels_for_life - 2013-01-04 1:31 AM

AngelsRedRum - 2013-01-03 6:06 PM
Angels_for_life - 2013-01-03 5:54 PM I don't think people understand what it is to be a bigot. Torii being uncomfortable around gays does not make him a bigot, nor does him thinking homosexuality is wrong make him a bigot. Bigotry is defined as hate towards a group. I don't think this qualifies.
big·ot [big-uh?t] noun a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion. big·ot·ry [big-uh-tree] noun, plural big·ot·ries. 1. stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own. The word and/or description of hate is not found in any definition. (so says the internet)

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot

 

"a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance"



Wouldn't "hating the sin" fall under this definition?

Edited by the dude abides 2013-01-04 6:10 AM
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Torii_Fan1982
Posted 2013-01-04 7:42 AM (#1915934 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Orem Owlz

Posts: 139

haters!

i still love you torii!
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HaloMagic
Posted 2013-01-04 8:53 AM (#1915976 - in reply to #1915900)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 5418

the dude abides - 2013-01-04 6:09 AM

Angels_for_life - 2013-01-04 1:31 AM

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot

 

"a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance"



Wouldn't "hating the sin" fall under this definition?


From where I stand (or sit) Torii isn't doing anything that could be construed as hatred or intolerance. But I guess that goes down to how one views intolerance. I view intolerance as an action, not a mindset. Basic definition of tolerant is:

1. Allow the existence, occurrence, or practice of (something that one does not necessarily like or agree with) without interference.

I don't have any evidence that he hasn't disallowed the existence of gheyism but that's proving a negative. I think we have to assume he has allowed it unless proven otherwise.

His viewpoint and comments can be hurtful, damaging, and distasteful while simultaneously being not bigoted. I believe that to be the case. I think bigot is just simply the wrong word. Doesn't mean Torii is "right" on this one, though.

I should also add, Torii may very well be a bigot. I don't know. I just haven't seen any evidence that would fit that description yet. He just hasn't done anything to limit or restrict anyone from doing anything. The only limitations I've seen are the ones in his own character. That alone doesn't make him a bigot.
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the dude abides
Posted 2013-01-04 10:20 AM (#1916039 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult




Location: Peru
Disagree here. I view intolerance/bigotry as a mindset in addition to an action.

Heck, the definition above would mean my own grandmother wasn't an intolerant bigot, given that she didn't disallow the existence of blacks.
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Torridd
Posted 2013-01-04 11:39 AM (#1916103 - in reply to #1912630)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult


All-Star

Posts: 4892

Am I wrong to agree with Hunter? He's not saying he wouldn't talk to the guy. He just said he would feel uncomfortable which probably 90% of the ballplayers would...at least at the beginning.

Wasn't there a gay guy in Remember the Titans? Basically, as long as everyone is professional, it just takes a matter of getting accustomed to the situation. I would feel a bit antsy also. I don't know if the reporter messed with Hunter's quotes, but I didn't have a problem with anything that was mentioned in the article. Like so many have said here, I'm sure he's had several gay teammates over the years. I think "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is good, but if someone chooses to come out, then the players have to be professional.
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HaloMagic
Posted 2013-01-04 11:48 AM (#1916110 - in reply to #1916103)
Subject: Re: Torii Hunter - Having Gay Teammates would be Difficult



Hall of Fame

Posts: 5418

Torridd - 2013-01-04 11:39 AM

Am I wrong to agree with Hunter? He's not saying he wouldn't talk to the guy. He just said he would feel uncomfortable which probably 90% of the ballplayers would...at least at the beginning.

Wasn't there a gay guy in Remember the Titans? Basically, as long as everyone is professional, it just takes a matter of getting accustomed to the situation. I would feel a bit antsy also. I don't know if the reporter messed with Hunter's quotes, but I didn't have a problem with anything that was mentioned in the article. Like so many have said here, I'm sure he's had several gay teammates over the years. I think "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is good, but if someone chooses to come out, then the players have to be professional.


You aren't "wrong". But if you were famous you'd end up in the bad side of a college lesson someday. Times are a'changin'. Soon it won't be "okay" to admit gay people make you uncomfortable. Doesn't mean you're wrong. But the war is pretty much over. And the victors write the history books.

Also, "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" was oppressive and disgusting. I don't mean to insult you but you might want to look that one up again. Unless you are just referring to the idea of don't ask, don't tell and not the actual military policy. In which case it's still oppressive unless it applies equally to everyone.
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