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Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-26 12:41 AM (#1885649)
Subject: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-lJl0v-90IUw/TWR671RgC2I/AAAAAAAAFRc/JyWtyY3cv8o/s400/WILLIES-WIRE-02.gif

Post your questions here for Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson and we'll make sure he answers them.

The chat will not be live, only to our writers, but it will be posted at a later time this winter.

Anything you want to know about an Angels prospect, Ric will know more than anyone here. I've picked his brain and others within the organization to form our top-50 prospects list which will be posted later this month. 

Speaking of which. Saltzer, Stedman and myself have come up with our list, which will be filled with scouting reports later on in December. As a teaser, here's our top 10 of 50...

1. Kaleb Cowart
2. Nick Maronde
3. C.J. Cron
4. Kole Calhoun
5. Luis Jimenez
6. Randal Grichuk 
7. R.J. Alvarez
8. A.J. Schugel
9. Eswarlin Jimenez
10. Travis Witherspoon

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Angels_for_life
Posted 2012-11-26 2:31 AM (#1885653 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Fame

Posts: 5002

Is there a specific reason you can attribute to CJ Cron's big drop in walks at IE? Was he being coached to be more aggressive or simply expanding his zone?
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ELEVEN
Posted 2012-11-26 5:41 AM (#1885656 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Fame

Posts: 6081

Location: My Old Fontucky Home
What the cock has gone so horribly wrong for us in player development?
J/k

I would like to know how Bourjos gets through our system without the faintest idea how to steal bases, and no aptitude for hitting the ball on the ground.
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ELEVEN
Posted 2012-11-26 5:44 AM (#1885657 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Fame

Posts: 6081

Location: My Old Fontucky Home
Feel free to phrase the above question any way you think is correct for the situation. I'll take your answer off the air...
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AngelStew43
Posted 2012-11-26 6:37 AM (#1885665 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com


Arkansas Travelers

Posts: 603

What about Taylor Lindsay? Not listed in Chuck's top 10, but tore it up last spring, and had a very good season as one of the youngest players in the Cal league.
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ettin
Posted 2012-11-26 7:59 AM (#1885684 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



All-Star

Posts: 2042

Location: Rancho Palos Verdes, California
Which Catcher, in the Angel's system, do you think will be ready to move to the Big League roster when Iannetta's contract expires and why?
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lewiss
Posted 2012-11-26 8:20 AM (#1885696 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com


Orem Owlz

Posts: 159

Even with all the recent high draft picks (over the past 2-4 years), the Angels continue to show a paucity of real pitching prospects. The starters who are considered the "hot" prospects get to double A or so and then just fade away. The relievers seem to be brought up too fast to the majors and get bombed. Others in the minors are just traded away after showing promise. One year the draft seems to be short relief pitchers. The next is tall, strong righthanded starters. The next year it's like any lefty available. I don't get the philosophy from year to year on scouting, drafting, teaching and advancing pitching prospects. Whatever it is, it doesn't seem to be working. (p.s. And it just kills me that the Angels can waste 60 million on Vernon Wells or whoever is the idiot signing of the year but won't pony up 3 million to sign solid prospects like Nick Castellanos 3b/of or James Paxton lhp when they could have been bought at the draft.)
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Angelsjunky
Posted 2012-11-26 9:49 AM (#1885726 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 7388

Location: Limbo
Which players step forward in 2013 as legit major league prospects? Any darkhorses?

Is it possible to salvage Ryan Bolden?

What causative factors would you attribute to the relatively disappointing results of so many Angels position player prospects over the last decade (Brandon Wood, Dallas McPherson, Casey Kotchman, Jeff Mathis, etc)?

Highest upside hitter in the organization?
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gotbeer
Posted 2012-11-26 10:16 AM (#1885741 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 20685

Who do you think is a sleeper prospect, that no one (see the above top 10) is talking about?
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Tyler
Posted 2012-11-26 10:50 AM (#1885756 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com


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Posts: 6136

Boo writers only, but I'll come up with some questions and post them here.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-26 12:36 PM (#1885829 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 7629

1. What do the Angels look for in potential prospects. (Pitchers, Infielders, Outfielders, Hitters etc)?

1a. At what point during the draft do they look best available at a certain point of the draft or projection of possible position switches for the Major League club in the future? Or, is this a per player deal?

2. Has there been any organizational changes in MO concerning College players compared to High School players?

3. We tend to draft more off the East Coast Florida, South. What is the reason for less players drafted out of Texas, Oklahoma (namely young pitchers) & California local products. Is this based on innings these young players have thrown annually due to the ability to playing year round growing up?

4. Will the new International Scouting allow us to grow on both sides. Or, will the Halos continue to look for more toolsies younger players internationally compared to the States. Seems over the years our middle infielders through the international means have been better prospects or rated higher than the same from the ML Draft. And we have developed less power hitting prospects internationally. Is this due to the age of the kids being signed internationally or based on need through the draft?

5. How does Scouting and Minor League Coaching development blend in getting the kids ready for the Majors? Seems there has been some disconnect between the two in regards to philosophies at times? Namely hitting, plate discipline, Base running, pitching and getting ahead in the count. Or, is this solely on the players drafted/signed who do not make the necessary adjustments in their game?




Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-26 12:40 PM
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angelduck
Posted 2012-11-26 12:42 PM (#1885832 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Salt Lake Bees

Posts: 995

You guys think Travis Witherspoon is a better prospect than Taylor Lindsey? Don't forget, Lindsey skipped Cedar Rapids and went straight to the IE. He held his own there. Maybe I just disagree.

Also, Kole Calhoun>>>>>CJ "I don't like to walk" Cron

Edited by angelduck 2012-11-26 12:44 PM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-26 1:13 PM (#1885856 - in reply to #1885832)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
angelduck - 2012-11-26 12:42 PM

You guys think Travis Witherspoon is a better prospect than Taylor Lindsey? Don't forget, Lindsey skipped Cedar Rapids and went straight to the IE. He held his own there. Maybe I just disagree.

Also, Kole Calhoun>>>>>CJ "I don't like to walk" Cron


Linsdey checked in at #11 on our list, just missing out in our top 10. Taylor is a solid prospect and is ahead of 39 other prospects in the organization, but there's a couple of things to note on him.

#1 Taylor has had trouble against lefthanded pitching, which could result in a future platoon situation in the big leagues.

#2 He doesn't have standout tool, though he makes solid contact and doesn't strikeout much while at the plate. He's average defensively at 2B with a fringe arm.

* Also, Witherspoon struggled in Double-A after his midseason promotion, but he still demonstrated better plate discipline than Lindsey. 29 BB for Lindsey | 57 BB for Witherspoon who also had a better showing in High-A (.319/.399/.470) than Lindsey (.289/.328/.408) and was consequently added to the Angels 40-man roster.

Witherspoon grades out ahead of Lindsey in power, speed, baserunning, defense, arm strength and showed dramatic improvement in plate discipline in 2012.

Cron is a future Mark Trumbo with a better batting average as he sprays line drives all over the field. He has game changing power, much of which has come late in the game to win ball games for the 66ers. Calhoun is a fine prospect and no slouch coming in at #4. Just not an impact player offensively the way Cron is. Most believe Cron's plate discipline will improve much like Trumbo's in his ascent to the big leagues.

When you hit close to .300 & slug .516 (Cron was over .300 for a good chunk of the season despite a slow start and until the shoulder gave him problems) with flare for the late inning dramatics, you turn scouts heads, despite the lack of walks.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-26 2:31 PM (#1885908 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 7629

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-26 3:32 PM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-26 5:34 PM (#1886024 - in reply to #1885908)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.
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YouthofToday
Posted 2012-11-26 9:50 PM (#1886132 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Location: Redondo Beach, Calif.
The thing is Trumbo's plate discipline hasn't improved. Perhaps his late season slide, especially in September, was due to an injury. Perhaps. I would be surprised if his bb% improves in 2013 (it was a measly 6.1% in 2012). Let's hope I'm wrong.

Very, very few players radically improve their plate discipline after the age of 23 or so.
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-26 10:49 PM (#1886156 - in reply to #1886132)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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YouthofToday - 2012-11-26 9:50 PM

The thing is Trumbo's plate discipline hasn't improved. Perhaps his late season slide, especially in September, was due to an injury. Perhaps. I would be surprised if his bb% improves in 2013 (it was a measly 6.1% in 2012). Let's hope I'm wrong.

Very, very few players radically improve their plate discipline after the age of 23 or so.


He was looking good in the first half until his injury set him back. He tried to do too much at the plate, when really he should have just kept doing what he was doing. Going the other way, talking walks, pounding the meatballs over the fence when in a good hitters count.

Mark Trumbo

April: .373 OBP
May: .407 OBP

June: .313 OBP
-Reported Upper Back/Rib Cage Soreness which lingered for the rest of the season-
July: .327

AUG: .263 OBP
Sept: .205 OBP
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tdawg87
Posted 2012-11-26 11:08 PM (#1886161 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 19315

lol @ .205. That's Mathisistic.

While I believe Trumbo's injury had a negative effect on his swing, it couldn't have possibly had that much of an effect on his rancid plate discipline. If anything you'd think he'd walk MORE.

That said, I fully expect another .260/30/90 season from him next year.
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GlenM
Posted 2012-11-26 11:11 PM (#1886163 - in reply to #1886156)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com




Chuck - 2012-11-26 10:49 PM

YouthofToday - 2012-11-26 9:50 PM

The thing is Trumbo's plate discipline hasn't improved. Perhaps his late season slide, especially in September, was due to an injury. Perhaps. I would be surprised if his bb% improves in 2013 (it was a measly 6.1% in 2012). Let's hope I'm wrong.

Very, very few players radically improve their plate discipline after the age of 23 or so.


He was looking good in the first half until his injury set him back. He tried to do too much at the plate, when really he should have just kept doing what he was doing. Going the other way, talking walks, pounding the meatballs over the fence when in a good hitters count.

Mark Trumbo

April: .373 OBP
May: .407 OBP

June: .313 OBP
-Reported Back/Rib Cage Soreness which lingered for the rest of the season-
July: .327

AUG: .263 OBP
Sept: .205 OBP





His April and May set unrealistic expectations for the rest of the year. I really hope the injury had something to do with August and September but I have some doubts. The pressure will really be on him at the start of next year.
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-26 11:14 PM (#1886164 - in reply to #1886161)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
tdawg87 - 2012-11-26 11:08 PM

lol @ .205. That's Mathisistic.

While I believe Trumbo's injury had a negative effect on his swing, it couldn't have possibly had that much of an effect on his rancid plate discipline. If anything you'd think he'd walk MORE.

That said, I fully expect another .260/30/90 season from him next year.


Yeah man, he was trying to do too much. Usually happens when you're playing through an injury.

In Trumbo's case, he tried to hit home runs as if he was in the HR derby instead of go the other way and attack the ball in good hitters counts. He got himself out by swinging at pitchers pitches.

He's never struck out (even in his minor league days) as much as he did in Aug and Sept.
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Mark68
Posted 2012-11-26 11:18 PM (#1886167 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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I hope it was the rib cage injury that caused the horrid late season slide, and not that he was adjusted to and never countered.
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tdawg87
Posted 2012-11-26 11:24 PM (#1886170 - in reply to #1886167)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Oh there's no question the book was out on him after his ridonkulus first half. He'll adjust though. In Eppard I trust.
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 9:42 AM (#1886275 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 29182

Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
Our chat with Ric Wilson is Thursday morning. If you don't want to post your questions in this thread you can PM me here or email them to me at chuck@angelswin.com

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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 10:08 AM (#1886293 - in reply to #1886024)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 7629

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 10:27 AM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 10:38 AM (#1886306 - in reply to #1886293)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Famer

Posts: 29182

Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 10:47 AM (#1886313 - in reply to #1886306)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Fame

Posts: 7629

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:38 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.


ummm Chuck it happens everywhere not only in Pro Sports....And what I meant was that Chris & CJ are pretty close to the same player at the same age it was an example. Chris didn't do real well in his two stays. Check their stats side by side at the same age.

Also, you state well CJ was injured. That is also part of the game. Many Minor Leaguers and College players have had their careers changed by injuries. Still gotta hit, plate discipline, pitch recognition.

And BB's vs K's they look pretty close.

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 11:17 AM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 10:53 AM (#1886317 - in reply to #1886313)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Famer

Posts: 29182

Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:47 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:38 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.


ummm Chuck it happens everywhere not only in Pro Sports....And what I meant was that Chris & CJ are pretty close to the same player at the same age it was an example. Chris didn't do real well in his two stays. Check their stats side by side at the same age.


Again. You're assuming dad and son are the same player. I think that's ridiculous. Forget scouting, let's just compare father and son's stats in the minor leagues.

Maybe scouts should look at the fathers of an amateur's beer league stats before drafting them.

I've learned something new today.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 11:01 AM (#1886325 - in reply to #1886317)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



Hall of Fame

Posts: 7629

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:53 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:47 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:38 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.


ummm Chuck it happens everywhere not only in Pro Sports....And what I meant was that Chris & CJ are pretty close to the same player at the same age it was an example. Chris didn't do real well in his two stays. Check their stats side by side at the same age.


You're assuming dad and son are the same player. I think that's ridiculous. Forget scouting, let's just compare father and son's stats in the minor leagues.

I've learned something new today.


Actually, I'm not. Or, didn't mean for it to go that way.

I believe CJ has a while to go before we compare him to Trumbo. Also, on the learning curve side Trumbo should learn quicker as he has gone through the entire process and CJ hasn't as of yet.

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 11:06 AM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 11:04 AM (#1886328 - in reply to #1886325)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Posts: 29182

Location: AngelsWin.com: Where Angels Fans Are @
SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 11:01 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:53 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:47 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:38 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.


ummm Chuck it happens everywhere not only in Pro Sports....And what I meant was that Chris & CJ are pretty close to the same player at the same age it was an example. Chris didn't do real well in his two stays. Check their stats side by side at the same age.


You're assuming dad and son are the same player. I think that's ridiculous. Forget scouting, let's just compare father and son's stats in the minor leagues.

I've learned something new today.


Actually, I'm not. Or, didn't mean for it to go that way.


OK. Phew! I can assure you So Cal, if Ric Wilson thought he was getting Chris and not C.J. with the first pick I doubt he would have taken him.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 11:08 AM (#1886334 - in reply to #1886328)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Chuck - 2012-11-27 11:04 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 11:01 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:53 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:47 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:38 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.


ummm Chuck it happens everywhere not only in Pro Sports....And what I meant was that Chris & CJ are pretty close to the same player at the same age it was an example. Chris didn't do real well in his two stays. Check their stats side by side at the same age.


You're assuming dad and son are the same player. I think that's ridiculous. Forget scouting, let's just compare father and son's stats in the minor leagues.

I've learned something new today.


Actually, I'm not. Or, didn't mean for it to go that way.


OK. Phew! I can assure you So Cal, if Ric Wilson thought he was getting Chris and not C.J. with the first pick I doubt he would have taken him.


Actually, there is a GOOD QUESTION CHUCK!

How close does CJ Cron mirror his fathers ability level at this time/same stage in his career and what does he need to adjust to. To continue to make strides in his development....

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 11:10 AM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 11:27 AM (#1886352 - in reply to #1886334)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 11:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 11:04 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 11:01 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:53 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:47 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 10:38 AM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 10:08 AM

Chuck - 2012-11-26 5:34 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-26 2:31 PM

CJ's dad was the same way. Didn't translate to the majors though.


Mike Trout's dad (Jeff) wants to have a word with you.


Obviously Jeff & Mike are different compared to Chris & CJ. Jeff got to AA. Chris had a cup of coffee with both the Halos and Chi Sox.

Jeff obviously, was able to work on things with Mike though Mike has a much different skill set, body style and ability set than his father had. Jeff had an avg over .300 with a really good OBP. After watching Mike looks like the ability to get deep into ab's has allowed him to wait for a pitch that he can drive to right center and take what has been given to him.

CJ & Chris are pretty close in size and ability as their stats and body style mirror each other both are/were right handed power hitters. CJ will need to have better plate discipline and cut down on the strike outs and get more walks.

Pedigree aside, it is always the one who works harder and refines their tools and being able to be the best with their ability that will go further than the other.

Position of need on the field and in the lineup helps also... We needed a catalyst last year in Mike plus there really wasn't anything left to prove in the Minors. At this time today a MOTO Bat has time to develop in CJ and hopefully he is able to work on what is needed to have a outstanding future in the middle of the Halos lineup.



Point is, it's ridiculous to compare father and son's successes or lack thereof in the big leagues. Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr. and several other comparisons are just not fair, just like there's some fathers who have done well and their sons have flamed out.


ummm Chuck it happens everywhere not only in Pro Sports....And what I meant was that Chris & CJ are pretty close to the same player at the same age it was an example. Chris didn't do real well in his two stays. Check their stats side by side at the same age.


You're assuming dad and son are the same player. I think that's ridiculous. Forget scouting, let's just compare father and son's stats in the minor leagues.

I've learned something new today.


Actually, I'm not. Or, didn't mean for it to go that way.


OK. Phew! I can assure you So Cal, if Ric Wilson thought he was getting Chris and not C.J. with the first pick I doubt he would have taken him.


Actually, there is a GOOD QUESTION CHUCK!

How close does CJ Cron mirror his fathers ability level at this time/same stage in his career and what does he need to adjust to. To continue to make strides in his development....


I'll ask something along those lines.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 11:31 AM (#1886358 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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I was just comparing their walk and K's figures Chuck.... The rest AVG OBP OPS are pretty identical.


Chris had a breakout year in AA Midland 22 Bombs 103 RBI's. He was 3 years older...If you use Chris stats while with the Halos check out the closeness. minus the age gap~

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 12:29 PM
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 11:40 AM (#1886365 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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1. Chris Cron
2. Lee Stevens
3. Reggie Montgomery
4. Brandon Wood
5. George Arias

There have been more...

Historically, we don't do real well with developing power hitters. After they pass AA thoughts? Is this based on the BB's/K's comparison? AVG's are high, OBP is high, OPS is high??? What gives? Could it be coaching or are these kids just not good enough or not Major League caliber? What stalls the development? Is it they don't get a chance to fail at the big league level? Kid Gloves in the minor leagues?

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 11:42 AM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 11:48 AM (#1886367 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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In just 163 Minor League Games C.J. Cron has put up a .301 BA, .350 OBP, .900+ OPS, 40 HR, 37 2B and 164 RBI. That's more than an RBI per game. He did this all with a torn labrum!

SICK!

No comparison to his dad's lengthy minor league career. Cron put up above numbers in just one game over a full MLB season of games.

I would be more worried about him staying healthy than worrying about his low walk rate.

However Cron's collegiate numbers show he has a good idea at the plate.

2010: .487 OBP (17 BB/23 K)
2011: .517 OBP (31 BB/ 21 K)

I'm not worried. Kid can rake!


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Angel Oracle
Posted 2012-11-27 12:02 PM (#1886372 - in reply to #1886367)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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I only wish Cron was a lefty, because if Morales leaves we are without ANY lefty power until Cowart develops further.

Very few teams make the post-season without any real lefty power.
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 12:03 PM (#1886374 - in reply to #1886372)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Angel Oracle - 2012-11-27 12:02 PM

I only wish Cron was a lefty, because if Morales leaves we are without ANY lefty power until Cowart develops further.

Very few teams make the post-season without any real lefty power.


I'm thinking by then Calhoun and Cowart will be a fixture in our lineup. Wouldn't worry about it.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 12:50 PM (#1886402 - in reply to #1886367)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Chuck - 2012-11-27 11:48 AM

In just 163 Minor League Games C.J. Cron has put up a .301 BA, .350 OBP, .900+ OPS, 40 HR, 37 2B and 164 RBI. That's more than an RBI per game. He did this all with a torn labrum!

SICK!

No comparison to his dad's lengthy minor league career. Cron put up above numbers in just one game over a full MLB season of games.

I would be more worried about him staying healthy than worrying about his low walk rate.

However Cron's collegiate numbers show he has a good idea at the plate.

2010: .487 OBP (17 BB/23 K)
2011: .517 OBP (31 BB/ 21 K)

I'm not worried. Kid can rake!





Don't build him up to B Wood just yet~ Let's let the kid grow on his own!
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 12:59 PM (#1886409 - in reply to #1886402)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 12:50 PM

Chuck - 2012-11-27 11:48 AM

In just 163 Minor League Games C.J. Cron has put up a .301 BA, .350 OBP, .900+ OPS, 40 HR, 37 2B and 164 RBI. That's more than an RBI per game. He did this all with a torn labrum!

SICK!

No comparison to his dad's lengthy minor league career. Cron put up above numbers in just one game over a full MLB season of games.

I would be more worried about him staying healthy than worrying about his low walk rate.

However Cron's collegiate numbers show he has a good idea at the plate.

2010: .487 OBP (17 BB/23 K)
2011: .517 OBP (31 BB/ 21 K)

I'm not worried. Kid can rake!





Don't build him up to B Wood just yet~ Let's let the kid grow on his own!


I'm building up C.J. Cron, not Brandon Wood.

B-Wood didn't have this type of success in his first 163 games. Two different ball players too. Totally different swings.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 1:08 PM (#1886414 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Your right Chuck he "Brandon Wood" did better in less games!


43 HRS +14 in the AFL in his Rookie Season in A BAll..A jump to AAA for the playoffs.. Plus 13 First year honors!

2005 RC CAL .321 130 536 109 172 51 4 43 115 360 48 128 7 3 .383 .672 1.054
2005 SLC PCL .316 4 19 1 6 2 1 0 1 10 0 6 0 0 .316 .526 .842


Set new Angels' franchise and California League single season record with 43 HR in 2005 (Dick Simpson, 42, 1962, San Jose)...His 53 doubles, 370 total bases and 101 extra-base hits are also new Angels' minor league marks...Named to 2005 Regional Olympic Qualifying Team team (.238, 1 HR, 4 RBI)...Played for Scottsdale Scorpions in Arizona Fall League, hitting .307 with league-leading 32 RBI and AFL record 14 home runs.


11/15/2005 MLB.com Minor League Offensive Player of the Year
11/15/2005 MLB.com Class A Offensive Player of the Year
11/11/2005 AFL All-Prospect Team
10/16/2005 AFL Player of the Week
10/10/2005 Baseball America Minor League All-Star
10/10/2005 Baseball America High Class A All-Star
09/08/2005 Minor League Baseball Round Tripper Award
09/05/2005 CAL Most Valuable Player
09/05/2005 CAL Post-Season All-Star
08/28/2005 CAL Player of the Week
07/10/2005 Futures Game Selection
06/28/2005 CAL Mid-Season All-Star
05/08/2005 CAL Player of the Week


After looking at all of these stats and awards was there any wonder why this kid in the end couldn't handle it up here? The Ruthian start and projections and all the pressure of an entire franchise and fan base etc. put up on this kid? No wonder he failed. And everyone popped off on him!

Even in 06' he won more awards:

2006 ARK TEX .276 118 453 74 125 42 4 25 83 250 54 149 19 3 .355 .552 .907

09/22/2006 Baseball America Double-A All-Star
08/28/2006 TEX Post-Season All-Star
07/02/2006 TEX Player of the Week
06/20/2006 TEX Mid-Season All-Star



2007 SLC PCL .272 111 437 73 119 27 1 23 77 217 45 120 10 1 .338 .497 .835
2007 Majors .152 13 33 2 5 1 0 1 3 9 0 12 0 0 .152 .273 .424


2008 Minors .296 103 395 82 117 21 2 31 84 235 45 104 6 5 .375 .595 .970

1.5 years away from A ball and the kid gets a taste of the Big Leagues...That's your ending to a remarkable story! Kid was RUSHED. And I'll bet had too many people in his ear about what kind of adjustments needed to be made.

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 1:38 PM
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-27 1:15 PM (#1886416 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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I get excited about the kids too Chuck don't get me wrong! I just don't put added emphasis on what they do till they get to the Big Leagues! There is enough pressure put on them by the organization, fish wrap, blog reporters, fans and themselves.

I have been a fan of this team long enough to see more than my fair share of power prospects fizzle with this organization! I'll wait till they get here. And cheer them on when they arrive!

Edited by SO CAL HALOS FAN 2012-11-27 2:17 PM
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 3:03 PM (#1886505 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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My point, let's not read anything into C.J. vs. his dad Chris, Mike Trout and his dad Steve, Brandon Wood vs. C.J. Cron.


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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-27 9:55 PM (#1886709 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Tomorrow is the last day to get your questions in for Ric Wilson.

We have about 40 already so only good questions make the cut at this point.
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Angels_Baseball
Posted 2012-11-27 10:04 PM (#1886713 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Which position player/pitcher do you think will break out this year and move up in everyone's prospect rankings?

Which starter outside of Maronde do you see making an impact in the majors this year?

When approaching the draft, do you generally pick the best available player or do pick for positional needs?

Which pitcher has the best stuff in the system?

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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-28 10:10 PM (#1887576 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Last call to get your questions into me for Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson.
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-29 10:52 AM (#1887824 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Just concluded nearly two hours of chatting live with Ric Wilson. Tons of insight, information and analysis from the director of scouting.

I will post a chat transcript later.
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Dave Saltzer
Posted 2012-11-29 10:56 AM (#1887832 - in reply to #1887576)
Subject: RE: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com


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Be sure to check out our chat transcript with Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson. Lots of great information in there!
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-29 12:36 PM (#1887981 - in reply to #1885649)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Edge of seat !!! Can't wait to see Ric's insight into the world of our Future Halos and the pre-draft process!
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Chuck Richter
Posted 2012-11-29 12:48 PM (#1888003 - in reply to #1887981)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-29 12:36 PM

Edge of seat !!! Can't wait to see Ric's insight into the world of our Future Halos and the pre-draft process!


Longest chat we've ever done. 2 hours long! Tons of insight and rich information on the prospects.
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SO CAL HALOS FAN
Posted 2012-11-29 1:17 PM (#1888074 - in reply to #1888003)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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Chuck - 2012-11-29 12:48 PM

SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-29 12:36 PM

Edge of seat !!! Can't wait to see Ric's insight into the world of our Future Halos and the pre-draft process!


Longest chat we've ever done. 2 hours long! Tons of insight and rich information on the prospects.


Thanks Chuck & the other guys! I appreciate all of these very cool opportunities you get to provide us here at Angelswin!
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Inside Pitch
Posted 2012-11-29 1:21 PM (#1888083 - in reply to #1886358)
Subject: Re: Angels Scouting Director Ric Wilson Chats with AngelsWin.com



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SO CAL HALOS FAN - 2012-11-27 11:31 AM

I was just comparing their walk and K's figures Chuck.... The rest AVG OBP OPS are pretty identical.


Chris had a breakout year in AA Midland 22 Bombs 103 RBI's. He was 3 years older...If you use Chris stats while with the Halos check out the closeness. minus the age gap~


You can't ignore age gaps -- thats one of the mistakes people make when evaluating a player. A 19 year old in High A hitting .280/.330/.450 is a significantly more impressive player than a guy 24 year old hitting 320/.370/.515 in most cases because he is typically playing against more experienced more developed competition.

I'm not the biggest fan of Cron because of the complete disappearance of his supposed plate discipline, but there really is little comparison between father and son. Chris was 25 and in a notoriously hitter friendly park and league when he finally posted an OPS above .800. Say what you will about the Cal League's offensive tendencies, CJ played is a much less hitter friendly park and again -- he was significantly younger.

The optimal age for a player in AA in 89 was 22 according to John Benson, who would later go on to author the Future Stars series of prospect handbooks. Chris was three years behind the curve.
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